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Old 04-28-2019, 10:06 PM   #1
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Default State of Our Hobby

Ukrainian_Falcons PM'd me recently and suggested I start a thread on the "state of our hobby," which I thought was a terrific idea. This is a rather broad topic that covers just about everything in diecast modeling, which is fine if that's where everyone wants to take it. But my interpretation is a little more narrow, more oriented toward where this industry is going, developments that might impact the hobby, what we can expect in years to come, trends, buyer wishes—stuff like that.

Or … it can be anything you wish it to be: your model likes and dislikes, what you'd like to see changed and/or maintained, the reasons you still collect, how you collect, why you're leaving the hobby, etc., etc., etc. I see this as a pontification palace, a thread to share your hearts out loud. The field can be wide open if you desire.

I say this with affection, but I would caution everybody to remember that we all love the same hobby, which makes us a kind of brotherhood. It would be sad if member comments devolve into a food fight, the flinging of caustic remarks and toxic sarcasm. We're better than that, and I'm sure we can keep things light.

OK, having said that …

I'm a pessimist about where our hobby is headed, and I don't apologize. It's true I've been saying this for nearly a decade; but I don't see military model collecting surviving past six or seven years. And why?

Because the average model collector can hardly afford the hobby. First, this person has already spent a fortune on models and finds it difficult to support his addiction. Second, he's running out of or has already run out of room to store them; unless he lives in a mansion blessed with space, it's getting ever harder to find closets and or attics (lofts) and or garages to toss them in. Third, his wife and/or girlfriend is rebuking him for not spending money on her new wardrobe (or not sinking money into his kids' college savings accounts). And lastly, he's just burned out. He's been at this for years, and it finally dawned on him that he needs to quit.

If any of the above is true, then a goodly part of the buying base has, is, or will say bye-bye to model collecting, taking a huge chunk of sales with them. And if enough buyers leave, manus like Hobby Master, et al., will find it impossible to continue to produce product profitably. Only moneyed and/or crazy collectors will remain, far too few to sustain it all.

There, I said it. Now it's your turn …
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:08 PM   #2
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Interesting thread.

As I pointed out in your splendid thread Richtofen888 I am an optimist with respects to our Hobby. And whilst there maybe a slow down in actual, numbers being manufactured (run numbers) the Hobby is way more diverse and cosmopolitan than what it was 10 years ago.

As I mentioned before,......I think lads who have been around for a while confuse the Golden Age (Days whatever) with dumps. They are two different things. Manufacturers made a squillion per release, often as an unlimited release, such as some Corgi and most of Franklin Mint models. Ultimately they dumped which ruined some manufacturers or individual lines. Franklin Mint, Dragon 1:72, Witty come to mind.

The only thing one does not see today,...that one was able to buy back in the day was Franklin Mint 1:48 Heavies. Many of Franklin Mint 1:48 toolings are being represented today,.....but much better toolings (in most cases).

But you never had the cross section of nations represented back then, compared to what you have today. Good Lord,...and SU22 and SU24. Even a week before they were announced no one seriously thought they would be released.

And 1:48 Jets is making a resurgence. Corgi with the Frightening and Spey powered F4. HM has confirmed the 1:48 Jets is being seriously looked at (including the J79 F4) and there maybe some news early next year.

More WW2 1:48 toolings are coming. The Gustav for one. The early P40s are just starting to hit the retailer shelves.

Some toolings just make money like no other tooling in Diecast History. HM's F4, F16, F111 (pretty much any HM Jet) are money making toolings who have long paid themselves off. The RAAF ARDU F111 and another RAAF F111 will be announced soon for example.

HM have also announced the F105G,...as a brand new tooling. There is some talk HM are also tooling a Draken,...plenty of us are scratching our head over that one.

WW2 has, to some extent, slowed down some. But Corgi Heavies still do very well as do some Corgi toolings such as the 109G. And as I mentioned HM are powering on with WW2 1:48.

Challenges do exist,..namely, demographically collectors are getting older. But, in Britain for example,.....Tiger Hobbies is taking a punt on warbirds will reignite interest with the young ones. For those who have been to Duxford, RIAT etc etc, you will know airshows in the UK are as popular as ever. Not to mention Avalon in Australia is still going strong with huuuge crowds.

I really dislike warbirds vs wartime schemes (and I have been very critical of one or two releases which caused some angst),...….but the point is there are some people in the trade who are making a real effort to gather young collectors.

I cannot speak for the US,...but I imagine that its the same.

That's why I am optimistic. I think in some ways its a false narrative created due to the confusion on what the Golden Days actually are. There never has been so much diversity, types and scales in our Hobby. And plenty of people are trying to keep it that way.

Any correlation between the lack of posting in this place and the state of the Hobby,.....is misleading and a waste of time. For a start, most collectors don't post, anywhere. Secondly, the Military Section of DA.F has had its own challenges. The state of the Hobby has bugger all to do with posting numbers in this place. For a start, there maybe 2-3 members who talk about WW2,...which is still a substantial part of the Hobby,...particularly in 1:48.

Aviation 72, JCWings, Oxford, HM, Calwings, Century Wings, Corgi, Air Force 1/Terebo, Air Commander, Altaya/IXO, Forces of Valour, Herpa, TSM are all active.

Aoshima, Marushin, Canadian Warplane Heritage and Gemini have gone quiet but still have potential.

Hardly a list indicating decline.
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:23 PM   #3
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I miss Falcon Models, I hope some day someone of the current manufacturer can bring back their moulds, specially the mirage F-1
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:52 PM   #4
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I think as a whole, we are much better off than where we were a decade ago or two decades ago. Yes, diecast planes as a whole is probably not what it used to be in the 80's and early 90's when you could find inexpensive diecast air planes at local toy shops and movies like Top Gun really propelled the hobby. But still, I think we are way better off as far as diversity is concerned and it seems like there is a more concentrated effort by manufacturers to produce as much aircraft as possible in a years time. And they seem to be taking more risks too. Gone are the days when all we used to see are the F-117 from Desert Storm, the B-2 Spirit, the Air Force Thunderbirds, the Jolly Rogers in their F-14 scheme and the F-15 Eagle that few out of Andrews AFB at a near constant pace. We have sort of reached this golden age where everything under the sun is fair game. And that includes every livery, every generation of aircraft, every branch of the military and every conceivable aircraft variant. There doesn't seem to be any end in sight. So things are good now. Real good.
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Old 04-29-2019, 10:28 AM   #5
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Thanks for taking the time to create such a thread David, I agree this could be a great catch all thread where we can discuss trends, manus, ideas and concerns.

I think there is a general malaise amongst collectors, we see more selling up and fewer new collectors but maybe here is also manu burnout as well.

I'm not even sure it's a pricing issue, sure there will be those that tap out now that the average model costs nearly double then what it was many years ago, personality I hate the increase but can accept it, IF the quality is maintained to a decent standard, not increased, just maintained that when I get a model, I'm not immediately disappointed taking it out of the box, it's almost to the point where I will quickly take it out of the box, shove it into the cab and stand back the necessary 3 feet to observe it, I certainly felt that way recently when buying my first HM model this year. This time last year I had already collected 8 models, this year just the 2 so far.

I paid a premium for this model for what it was and if the quality been on point, I wouldn't for a second consider that I paid too much, the scheme and most of the model is great but with a few silly niggles which could have been avoided had better care been taken. I felt like this model was probably worth $10-20 less what it should have been. What was more annoying was that it's one of HMs bread and butter moulds and one they had used quiet a lot recently so the new factory should have perfected its process by now.

But maybe this is a result of an over ambitious release schedule which I think has finally caught up with them now that they have changed factories. The market has clearly shrunk, I'm not basing this off any forum but what I see happening with dealers, on eBay and with the average run of 500 units compared to 1000s years ago, even Calibre had cut its original 1000 Fencers to 800 and there is cloud over whether 800 even made it out the factory. Two years ago, dealers could post a drawing of a model, there not even being a pre pro out and it was on shelves and the model would sell out immediately on the blind, now such listings are treated with caution and I think that's in part because collectors have wisened up. I'm also seeing dealers having to hold onto stock longer and having to reduce it in order to clear some stock away. Could it be price ? Or scheme ? Or maybe collectors have had enough collecting certain moulds ?

Also I think HM went abit over the top and wasted a lot of time and $ with the 1/6 figures, space shuttles and ships instead of focusing on their aircraft models and investing the money on improving them. Also maybe not hemorrhaging money on new lines which were unsuccessful might of kept the price down of other models as well. But I believe that at this point, HM have been propping the hobby up for the last few years now, if they were to go, game over man, game over.

The amount of manus has also shrunk in the past 5 years, we are down to what ? HM, JCW, Corgi (but with stickers and weird stands) and Calibre, anyone else is not producing models in any sort of quantity or quality to even bother mentioning. At the same time, HM should cut down on the spamming of bland releases, it's one thing to not produce much but it's another to over produce and fall short on the quality. Is there a need for a premium line, nope, just get the basics right and maintain a certain standard and I'm sure most of us will be happy to spend good amounts of money on a nicely turned out model, point in case, the Su-34 Ladia just posted, there are things wrong with it no doubt, for me it's the underside colour they used (cringe) but it looks well made, if HM could do that with all their models, all (ok most of) the time, that would be great.

The reduction in quality then has a flow on effect for collecting habits, at least for me anyway and I think it may also for some of you as well. I like to collect by theme so I try to collect as many models as possible for each of my themes. I was really hoping to start some Warsaw Pact themes when I heard about the Floggers, I waited and waited for some to get announced, finally 2 great schemes in the form of 1 Polish, 1 Czech, at the same time !! The wait was over. Then came the pre pros :-( and seeing them in the metal, wonky tails, glue stains, mismatch coloured parts... bye bye Warsaw Pact themes 👋🏻 Now the flow on effect is, I don't have the Floggers, is there any point continuing to chase other models, well as a completionist, if I'm missing an integral part of the theme then no point, abandon theme and maybe pick out the models I really want. Oh and before that, the really REALLY bad Egyptian Fishbed, that was another reason to stop continuing other themes. What does this all mean? Well it meant I didn't get the Iraqi Foxbat I was originally going to get, then the Arab Floggers were a mess of their own, pretty much by that point, if I wasn't able to kind of complete a theme, I wasn't going to get a model I probably didn't need to have but would have normally gotten to complete it. In terms of the Warsaw Pact theme, I then didn't bother with the Czech MiG-17 or the Polish version or the Polish MiG-21PFM as a result. Again that's just my way of collecting, those models above are all VERY average on their own but would look nice as part of a wider completed theme.
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Old 04-29-2019, 11:34 AM   #6
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

This is wonderful, guys! Really enjoyed reading your viewpoints, largely because they offer sensible perspectives I hadn't considered.

Ukrainian_Falcons really deserves the credit for this thread considering it was his idea. I'd love to see this conversation expand and take all sorts of directions covering all sorts of topics under the "State of Our Hobby" rubric. I'm already finding the chitchat helpful and engaging.

To those members who lurk in the background and haven't posted lately (or at all), please feel free to join in. That goes for everybody else, too. We'd love to hear from you!
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Old 04-29-2019, 03:58 PM   #7
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I have been pondering this question (state of our hobby) with some time now.
It is rather concerning that frequently now we see the obvious selling up of collections.
We also have the demise of some class manufactures, Dragon Wings, and others, while at the same time we have the slowing down of stalwarts like Corgi.
Apart from storage and cost, I think our problem is twofold.
1, the big seller model aircraft types have now been covered for the most part.
2, the most important one, when I was making plastic models by the ton back in the sixties, and just as the hobby might be seen to slow a bit, a brilliant solution came to the rescue, DECAL SHEETS by the million by every small time operator, for every ace out there!!
A whole new aspect to the hobby was unveiled, for instance I can't remember the number of BF109's alone I purchased to complete in the different schemes possible. It went on for years- even to this day..
So unlike the plastic modeller with these choices, we (now, I'm too old for plastic)) Diecast collectors are confined to what the manufactures decide.
And too be fair we are well enough served, but the vast variety of schemes available for even one model can never happen in Diecast.
But for myself I spread my interest to cover more than models, I buy aviation DVD's, many aviation books, and some prints and these help to fill out the lack of some longed for models,- "where's my RF101C"...….
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Old 04-29-2019, 07:23 PM   #8
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I only recently started collecting, about 2 years ago. I am 21 now so when I was able to start affording to purchase models, I began investing in 1:400 models. My parents refused to purchase me diecast models when I was younger and felt it was a waste of time and money. For me, collecting is a release and a sense of pride. I won't lie, I am not an aviation expert, I do not work in the field and still do not know how precise some of these moulds and models are, but I just enjoy collecting. I have collected about 120 models over the last 2 years. Now I am looking to design my own airport. I started collecting Boeing 757's and Ilyushin models but felt that there wasn't enough models of different airlines made. Then I switched to collecting models that had sport related liveries, models of aircrafts I would see on Mayday then just models that had aesthetically appealing liveries. I am glad that NG models have entered the scene, I have scooped up plenty of their 757's and I also like the Aeroclassic 757's. I feel that Gemini could do a better a job listening to their clientele and not block people on Facebook who criticize them.
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Old 04-29-2019, 07:28 PM   #9
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I'm of a more pessimistic view of the hobby, I'm afraid.
We have lost Witty, Gemini Aces & Dragon Warbirds- 3 of the key players in the diecast game.
Hobbymaster have abandoned their mission statement to be better but cheaper than the competition, ie Corgi- they are no longer either of those things. Corgi now tend to produce models better than HM, at the same price or slightly cheaper.

Hobbymaster's 'budget' range, Skymax, are now even more expensive than HM's standard 1/72 WW2 range.
Prices are through the roof, while quality is deteriorating in many cases.
Requests for planes that should be no-brainers are ignored.
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Old 04-30-2019, 01:47 AM   #10
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I merely gave you a little push there was clearly interest in your off topic question in your fantastic review thread, it would be a shame to spoil it.

It's true, there's a good variety of aircraft but the variety with schemes is seriously lacking and this is because manus (they all do it) rely heavily on copying from plastic kits, so they can replicate the decals. So really if you want to know what diecast manus possibly have in store for us, go google Trumpter etc and you basically know what might come out. If it wasn't done as a kit or even an aftermarket decal sheet, it won't get done.

Hey Ron97, welcome to this side of the forum. While I was searching to see if a topic like this had ever come up, I came across a 1/400 thread from about 10 yrs ago. At that time, some collectors were thinking 1/400 was on the decline, fast forward 10 years later, it's probably the safest and fastest growing scale. New manus, improved moulds, re-releases. You guys are really spoilt. And it's sounds like you have taken full advantage of it.

Dragon Wings, Witty, Falcon Models, Skymax, these are the guys that kept it going in between releases from HM and Century Wings. That's why theres a big gap now, when nothing of interest was out from HM/CW, you could turn to those manus to keep up the momentum. HM seem to be burnout, a lot of the releases this year lack effort.

On a more positive note, what are ppl looking out for or forward too ? I'm still waiting to get a Supet Hornet scheme I like, a decent BF-109 and a white Zero that gets my attention.

HMs July poster has got me finally interested in something from this year and I'm waiting to see how the JGSDF Apache turns out because as it stands, the scheme layout is dreadfully wrong, I'll🤞🏻 it'll turn out correctly, that and an Israeli Apache are the ones I want.

I hoping JCW show us more of their Su-34 soon so I can decide whether to get HM or JCW. And to see the improvements to Calibres Su-24. Otherwise there's still wave 3 to look forward to.
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Old 04-30-2019, 02:42 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Umpire View Post
I miss Falcon Models, I hope some day someone of the current manufacturer can bring back their moulds, specially the mirage F-1
Not sure about someone else getting hold of and using the Falcon moulds but I would love to see a manu come out with their own mould, cough HM cough.

Besides, wouldn't that manu have to pay for licensing ?
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Old 04-30-2019, 01:47 PM   #12
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I'm not sure if this topic makes for a good fit here, but I'll shoehorn it in anyway and hope for the best. Here goes …

Do you feel a sense of guilt when you purchase a model that doesn't measure up to other modelers' standards?

I’ll explain. Some collectors advocate that we should buy flawless models only (or close to flawless models) and reject the rest. These folks understand that perfection doesn’t exist but also realize that some models are far more accurate and desirable than others; and this being so we should purchase only the best and nothing else to encourage manufacturers to produce more of the same. Some carry this dogma even farther and insist that collectors who buy subpar models should be disgraced for sustaining the continued production of junk.

Whew, that's a mouthful. But I clearly recall several threads in other diecast forums years ago that out-and-out ridiculed members who purchased models based solely on predilections and personal preference, not accuracy and/or "acceptability."

So let me rephrase the original question: Do you give a donk what others think of the models you buy? Are you concerned that the Oxford De Havilland Mosquito you just purchased doesn't fit somebody else's definition of "acceptable"? Should you allow others to determine which models are suitable and which aren’t? And do you believe that manufacturers worldwide will sit up, take notice of what you do and don’t buy, and struggle to produce better models?

You can probably guess where I stand on this issue; but let me clarify: I'm not advocating trench seams, over-spray, incorrect camo and/or livery colors, cloudy canopies, glue smudges, inaccurate shapes or any of a myriad issues that exasperate military diecast model collectors. Given a choice, I much prefer accuracy and excellence. But I'm also a romantic: if I like a model, warts and all, I'll buy and enjoy the heck out of it simply because it speaks to me. I own shelves of models that purist collectors sneer at, but frankly I couldn't care less. If buying less-than models promotes mediocrity in this industry, so be it. Too bad. I like what I like, and that's all that matters to me.

OK, my friends, have at it. Am I wrong and should forthwith be ushered to the guillotine? Am I somewhere between right and wrong? Or do you, like me, sometimes like nasty, faulty little models just because they look cool?
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Old 05-01-2019, 01:14 AM   #13
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Good question, I don't think anyone should feel guilty buying a model, it's their money after all. Plus you know yourself, if you combine all the known English speaking forums together, that's not even close to how many people actually collect. So there are lots more people that don't know or even care what they are buying.

Take all those shockers from over the years, smurf F-15s, the first half dozen F-2s weren't right, the 1/48 Bf-109s with giraffe gears and bad molting and basically all the camo MiG-23s, these are mostly sold out by now regardless of how bad there are. So we can challenge that it's unacceptable but really, the manu already knows that they fell short, they aren't dumb, they just don't care and a lot of people also don't care.

I put this question out there, is it ok to point out a models flaws, manu model, not a collectors, in 15 years I don't think anyone has really bagged out someone's model, so that those out there that might care, are aware of what is wrong or should we cover our ears and run to the corner and get into the fetal position ?

As for inferior manus, gez I think it would be hard for most of us to not have some in our collections. If it's a model that will never be made in diecast and you have to have it, why not get it, you can always replace it if something better comes out. A few years back I bought a bunch of De Agostini magazine band models to fill out my IJNAS/AAS theme, nobody was probably ever going to do these in either 1/72 or 1/48. Some pleasantly surprised me, some were ok and some I wished I hadn't bothered with. Also there are those that cringe over pre made plastic models like Easy Model.

Anyone that is truely a purist isn't going to be collecting much or have massive holes in their themes. Take Airforce1 and Falcon Models to some extent, it was almost an 80/20 chance if you got a good copy or not and the gears on most of if not all models were pretty crapastic but they are both good gap fillers, that is their niche, producing jets that other manus will never touch. Who here doesn't have at least 1 Falcon Model or Airforce1 ?

As far as nasty flawed models goes, I'll put my hand up to 3 that I got knowing there was an issue. The PLAAF Su-35, I know that it's colours are questionable as is the pattern but it's a very nicely put together model and I grew to prefer the Su-35 over the -27. First digital Ukrainian Su-27 from JCW, it wasn't great and looks worse once you put the correctly painted Su-27UB next to it but it was a million times better then JCWs first Flanker. And finally my most guilty pleasure is the Topcats S-3 Viking 🤭 (cringe, trigger alert) 😖 goss darn that yellow leading edge but man what a great piece of work from HM, the fit and finish on it and their equally great EA-6 during that period was the pinnacle of HMs abilities. I still maintain that it's the most attractive and popular Viking HM made.

You totally bought an Oxford De Havilland Mosquito didn't you Dave 😝
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Old 05-01-2019, 07:23 AM   #14
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so, i'm just back from a few weeks in japan and a few days in china. i travel to japan regularly and have lived there for several weeks of my life.

so, there are two things:

1. the general state of "military modelling", including both plastic and diecast. i was quite surprised to see just how drastic the change has been in japan. military modelling is dying a slow but still quite steady death. the odd thing is that it has been replaced by endless amounts of robotech/gundam style robots in plastic kits. shops that used to be 90% military models, 10% gundam/robots are now 90% gundam, 10% military. young people don't go into the military stuff much.

honestly, the robot stuff to me looks stupid and identical. i realize that many might say the same thing about all the airplanes we collect, but, so it goes.

hobbymaster and other items are available here and there in japan, but to be honest i have more in my personal collection by a long shot than the topgun shop in akihabara has in stock at any given time.

so, if you believe that japan is ahead of the curve on these sort of things (and this is a big if, but not an implausible one) and if you believe that diecast follows plastic to some extent, then the long term future for our hobby is not great.

2. but let's talk medium term. there is some good news and some not so good news.

the not so good news is that a lot of us collectors - often middle aged - are at a saturation point of sorts in our collections. we have fueled the rise hobbymaster and its rivals and as a result we have too many blue boxes around. where before we were excited by hm releases, now we dont get that dopamine fix as much and that's not helped by the lack of continous improvement in the models that we all had hoped might happen. there is bound to be an inevitable cooling off period that i think has already started to some degree and this period will include a flattening of aftermarket (ebay) prices for your rare rare+++ bits of chinese mass manufatured metaloplastic.

the good news is that a small dip notwithstanding, i think the hobby is alive. i think calibre has it right that the future will increasingly be quality driven, though as they do produce more ambitious models they will have to deal with the absolute ****ing muppets with their "i paid 150 euro for this model i expect perfection" attitudes which can be the death of any business. i just had to pay some wrench turners $150 an hour to take the wings off an (real, small) airplane - this is a job that can be done by a high school student. the prices we pay for these models is still quite cheap.

but, the quality has to improve. as i've been saying for years, HM should make a 'pro finish' series and charge 50-100% more for it. i'd sure buy it. they'd be competibive with calibre at the top end and encourage existing customers to re-buy some of the stuff they arleady have but in a better format (much like people have re-bought 1/48 models from HM to replace inferiod Franklin Mint models).

I do think also that 1/72 WW2 is dead or dying for single-engine types. collectors are getting older and eyesight gets worse. anybody with eyes can see you get a heck of a lot more model from HM's P-40Cs at $80 than their 1/72 P-40Es in 1/72 at $70 (the latter have not unsurprisingly dumped and may represent the end of HM's 1/72 single-engine WW2). the question is what about historic aircraft in general? or is it all modern jets from here on in?

I think we will see or should see some rise in competitors to HM that will charge more money for more niche subjects. herpa is starting in this vein (alpha jet, pilatus, etc) but so far it is clear their moulds are substandard AF1/witty quality. who will make a 1/72 skyknight? i'd sure as heck buy one for $150 and i think the market will support 1000 accross 4 liveries. HM may not touch such a small amount of money - but someone might.

Also kind of good news is the economic slowdown in china, which is very real. it is not clear if this will cause manufacturing and lower prices to return to china. it might, but i am also a bit skeptical about this. china continues to be a mass of contradictions.

i will continue to collect what i like and as much as i like.
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Old 05-01-2019, 09:07 AM   #15
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I come to bring my two cents to this interesting discussion.
excuse for my english first... i took help from google trad.


I'm going to talk about my experience in the diecast and my "collection disease". Focused on 1/72.


I have been collecting since 2004, started with tanks (dragon armor) and very quickly, planes with HM, witty and dragon (it was even the end for Dragon at that time).
I am not an aviation specialist like Ladia, whose posts i appreciate about the errors made by the manus.
I am just a military history lover who loves airplanes and their aesthetics.
Thus, if defects are prohibitive for some collectors, me, I do with.
The error on the nose cone of the Witty Su-27 is huge ... but it goes, the plane is so huge and nice.

My only requirement would be painting. As UF, a little disappointed by the paintings made on the mig-23 because too dark and brilliant or JC wings screwing almost every time the colors.
But, being a fan of the flogger, I bought anyway.

Prices, obviously today's prices hurt anyway.
But my personal situation, allows me to buy. Ten years ago, I think I would never have started the collection.


Upgrading toward premium stuff will exclude a bunch of collectors, me first.
FS has mentioned Herpa ... I never bought Herpa, but for products identical to JC wings ... where is the problem? the more expensive it is, the better it is ? I do not believe. Marketing !


Calibre Wings, interested in their projects (Su-24, Su-22, F-16 ...), but the prices slow me down, especially when we see the criticisms made here.

At the moment, I am thoroughly on the personalization (code3) ... after 15 years of collection, the desire to have the models that I wish takes over and after all this time and lack of space, choices are needed ... so I buy, I sell, etc ...
I gave up the WW2 (except for some themes) and the Americans (except the phantoms)
The multiplication of Soviet planes fill me with happiness


the future of our hobby = innovation = new stuff regularly = and listening to collectors
I'm not familiar with HM's commercial policy, but being able to chat with one of its members live, I find it extraordinary (not like JC Wings and his rotten after sales service).
I ask regularly to HM about planned futures models, why another models are stopped, etc... 95% of anwsers, and some discussions... great rate !
Sometimes, i wonder why they chose this model (vigilante for example) or this scheme rather one wanted by collectors !
I would like to see a manu, HM for example, to create polls with some projects and collectors could vote... it would be nice.



Furthermore, i think many collectors are not involved into forum (it does not matter which), because, since i joined a FB group about diecast, i see quantities of people totally out from diecast community... and when i see the purchases made by these guys... diecast market have golden days ahead of him !


Of course, i keep collecting... but not at any price !

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Old 05-01-2019, 10:10 AM   #16
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

I have been collecting and modifying "diecast" warbird and armor models for over 20 years and it seems clear that the diecast collector hobby has been dramatically altered by the waves of cheapie pertwork lines introduced by Altaya, Atlas, etc. As a result, we have two forces pulling against the middle. Companies that charge high prices for superior low run products such as John Jenkins Designs, King & Country, Figarti, etc. seem to be doing well while the flood of low priced partwork and their aftermarket rerun cheapies continues unabated. Which means that reasonable quality formerly mainstream manufacturers like HM and Corgi are in trouble as they attempt to compensate by raising their prices and focusing mainly on British subjects ( Corgi ) or modern jets ( HM ).


In my case, I am running out of space to display models but am still gaining a measure of satisfaction by doing many code 3 projects, thereby customizing my collection. In this regard, I accept and modify many of the low quality cheapie models, focusing mainly on unusual subjects which are now available in large numbers, especially if you are flexible as regards scales.



Long term, I do not see much of a future for Corgi and HM unless they modify their business plans and offer two kinds of products. As has been noted by another poster, one of these would be high priced, low run but superior products to compete with JJD, K&C, Figarti, etc. among quality conscious and well healed collectors. The second and far more important, volume-wise, would be partwork or subscription lines which exploit existing quality toolings and add more unusual subjects---including many WW2 Italian, Russian, French,Japanese models as well as mediums, in general, floatplanes, trainers, transports, etc. Also worth pursuing would be post-war mediums and biggies, perhaps in a smaller scale ( 1:100th, for example ) including B-47s, B-36s, IL-28s, Badgers, Flying Boxcars, and many others.


Unless a drastic change in business thinking takes place at HM or Corgi, I doubt they will be around in five years but I hope that at least one of them accepts the realities of what is taking place and adapts. In any event, the hobby will probably survive in one or more forms but certainly not as it operates, currently.
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Old 05-01-2019, 11:16 AM   #17
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

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Originally Posted by Epap1 View Post
I have been collecting and modifying "diecast" warbird and armor models for over 20 years and it seems clear that the diecast collector hobby has been dramatically altered by the waves of cheapie pertwork lines introduced by Altaya, Atlas, etc. As a result, we have two forces pulling against the middle.
Epap i'm really surprised to hear that you place JJD, K&C and the like as 'superior low run products.' I'm hardly a shape fanatic, but even at first approximation it appears clear to me that the bulk of the aircraft they produce are unsatisfactory to those of us who are interested in the aircraft as technical objects. it's further not clear to me what you mean in stating that they are 'doing well.' a little quantity produced x sales priced analysis quickly shows that their total business is a small fraction of that of even hobbymaster.

don't get me wrong - part of me loves the artistry that goes into their stuff, but i think your analysis that the HMs of the world are in trouble because of JJD/K&C/etc m is totally off. and, for that matter, i dont think the magazine guys have that much effect, either.



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Originally Posted by Epap1 View Post
In my case, I am running out of space to display models but am still gaining a measure of satisfaction by doing many code 3 projects, thereby customizing my collection. In this regard, I accept and modify many of the low quality cheapie models, focusing mainly on unusual subjects which are now available in large numbers, especially if you are flexible as regards scales.
No argument there. You've been at the forefront of what is clearly an incrasing trend (code 3 and modification). I personally work on improving hobbymaster class models and don't touch the cheapies as you have, but in any case it seems this is a nice middle ground for an incrasing number of people.


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Unless a drastic change in business thinking takes place at HM or Corgi, I doubt they will be around in five years but I hope that at least one of them accepts the realities of what is taking place and adapts. In any event, the hobby will probably survive in one or more forms but certainly not as it operates, currently.
I'll bet you anything you want to bet that HM will still be around in 5 years. their business is too sound not to be. moreover, while the customer base bitches and moans, we have in the main accepted all the price increases. and they continue to release exciting things such as the russian/soviet aircraft of late and there's little sign of this abating.

corgi seems to have been on life support for a while and it pans me to say this but 1/48 EE lightnings and phantoms probably aren't going to save them.

1/100 is a dead scale. it has been the scale for low quality weirdo stuff only (magazine stuff, altaya stuff, japanese stuff of various distributions). it offers interesting subjects but in low quality.

incientally you just reminded me that i own the **** rossi figarti p-40 (signed). interesting piece, but rubbish as a model. again, i contend that most k&c/jjd/figarti stuff really is totally unsatisfactory for collectors who are interested in anything other than artistry. those brands are for people who collect hummel figurines and lead soldiers, not today's collector who is coming from not having time or skill to make plastic models.

so, we agree on some disagree on other stuff.
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Old 05-01-2019, 11:27 AM   #18
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

I add a thought i have about Corgi... even if i gave up WW2, i bought the Ju-52 over Crete, a no brainer for me.
But i find Corgi stucked with their moulds... any new moulds !
Again and again Ju-88, Ju-52, B-17, etc...



If no innovation by new mould... Corgi will crash
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Old 05-01-2019, 11:32 AM   #19
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

Yeah the only time I see any 1/100 scale models these days is at a rummage sale when I happen to spot something made by Motormax or one of those vintate "Force One" jets made by Ertl corp.1/72 scale planes have generally become the scale of choice when it comes to high end manufacturing. Just because its a scale that is easy to make in mass quantities and customers get plenty of bang for their buck when it comes to parts. Also you can find pieces that don't break the bank and cost no more than the average imported action figure.
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Old 05-01-2019, 12:17 PM   #20
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Default Re: State of Our Hobby

I didn't say this before, so perhaps I should say it here …

Honest to Pete, I don't want to see this hobby go south. I'm so addicted to diecast models I can't see straight, and the thought of Hobby Master and Corgi and Calibre Wings, et al., going yippee ki-yay somewhere down the road fills me with dread. I'm a prophet of doom when it comes diecast's future, have been for over a decade. But reading some of your posts makes me wonder if things might work out after all, that we can collect to our dying days. Wouldn't that be great?!

And this …

I've gotta say, it's such a pleasure to read your comments, guys. Studying your views and sentiments is a joy, a real pleasure; I appreciate all of you and hope we can keep this up. If you're a member who hasn't posted yet, jump in with both feet and have at it. We'd truly like to hear from you!!!
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Old 05-01-2019, 12:37 PM   #21
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FS, my assessment of the JJD, K&C, Figarti, etc. types is based largely on the huge increase in their collective output over the past five years. They must be selling these "premium" models to somebody. However, the basic threat to HM and Corgi comes from the Altayas, Amercoms, DeAgostinis, etc. of the diecast world and their endlessly recycled, cheaply produced, low priced products. This has probably expanded the hobby, drawing in folks who are less demanding quality-wise but like "good deals", while undercutting interest in the same subjects----mostly WW2---when made by HM and/or Corgi and sold at double or triple the retail price.


BlackAces, regarding the 1:100th scale, as well as the 1:87th and 1:120th scales, there are lots of these around--I have hundreds----but if one insists only on 1:72nd or 1:48th, then I can see why they might be regarded as oddballs. For example, the recent Italeri jet line featured many rather well done planes in the 1:100th scale and other1:100th scale jets, also of decent quality, were available from Amercom. As for the 1:120th scale, Hachette covered a ton of WW2 Japanese planes in this scale---Nell, Betty, Lily, Sally, Helen, Peggy, Frances, etc and they made many very nice 1:100 planes-Jake, Paul, Seiran, Kate, Val, Mary, Dinah, Ann, Judy, Jill, Myrt, Grace, Nick, P-38, JU-87D, TBF, etc. The 1:87th scale offers even more by GE Fabbri (Italian ) and Hachette ( Japanese, U.S. British and German ).In short, times are changing and so are the kinds of scales being offered.

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Old 05-01-2019, 01:07 PM   #22
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FS, my assessment of the JJD, K&C, Figarti, etc. types is based largely on the huge increase in their collective output over the past five years. They must be selling these "premium" models to somebody. However, the basic threat to HM and Corgi comes from the Altayas, Amercoms, DeAgostinis, etc. of the diecast world and their endlessly recycled, cheaply produced, low priced products. This has probably expanded the hobby, drawing in folks who are less demanding quality-wise but like "good deals", while undercutting interest in the same subjects----mostly WW2---when made by HM and/or Corgi and sold at double or triple the retail price.
I guess I view the primary market for the sort of diecast that HM makes as people who would be making scale models were it not for a lack of talent or time. i dont think too many of such people would choose a poor altaya 1/72 mirage over a hobbymaster one simply because of price. the altaya equivalents are just too poor for most releases (there are a few nice ones, but they are few and far between). the altayas and ixos of the world may make for cheap pickups in the 3 three for a tenner buyer at an airshow, but i dont think most of those people were really in the main on course to be HM/corgi customers anyway, if only for no other reason that the distribution mechanism for the cheapies is too erratic. they seem to plop out of some random chinese factory into unbranded boxes at random times.

that said, yes, inasmuch as corgi were milking a cash cow in their 1/72 ww2 planes that has since gone away, you have a point. but this is corgi's own fault for not going more into jets in general and more us subjects in particular. they had, what, 10 years to release a tomcat but didn't, probably for all sorts of reasons that the numpties who ran the show there at the time kept telling themselves made great sense. that said, if it wasnt for those numpties and their lack of vision, we also probably wouldnt have had some of the nicer and more obscure releases that corgi did end up doing (stuff like the blenheims).

oh, and corgi was and is utterly useless at using the internet to communicate. lets not forget that their entire aviation catalog's reference site (the privately run tricatus site) was effectively pulled by its maintainer over people linking to his images or some other trivial stupidity like this. now, its a private site and he can do what he wishes, but corgi was clueless. imagine what would happen if the HMC site disappeared for whatever reason tomorrow... i hope HM are paying him a backhander to have the site guaranteed up.

i think the jjds of the world are going after a customer base that has little in common with that of hobbymaster or corgi. i suspect jjds' customer base is older people and their increased production has come through effective marketing to such people. very few diecast shops that we recognize carry them and their ilk at all.
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Old 05-01-2019, 02:12 PM   #23
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I guess I view the primary market for the sort of diecast that HM makes as people who would be making scale models were it not for a lack of talent or time. i dont think too many of such people would choose a poor altaya 1/72 mirage over a hobbymaster one simply because of price. the altaya equivalents are just too poor for most releases (there are a few nice ones, but they are few and far between). the altayas and ixos of the world may make for cheap pickups in the 3 three for a tenner buyer at an airshow, but i dont think most of those people were really in the main on course to be HM/corgi customers anyway, if only for no other reason that the distribution mechanism for the cheapies is too erratic. they seem to plop out of some random chinese factory into unbranded boxes at random times.

that said, yes, inasmuch as corgi were milking a cash cow in their 1/72 ww2 planes that has since gone away, you have a point. but this is corgi's own fault for not going more into jets in general and more us subjects in particular. they had, what, 10 years to release a tomcat but didn't, probably for all sorts of reasons that the numpties who ran the show there at the time kept telling themselves made great sense. that said, if it wasnt for those numpties and their lack of vision, we also probably wouldnt have had some of the nicer and more obscure releases that corgi did end up doing (stuff like the blenheims).

oh, and corgi was and is utterly useless at using the internet to communicate. lets not forget that their entire aviation catalog's reference site (the privately run tricatus site) was effectively pulled by its maintainer over people linking to his images or some other trivial stupidity like this. now, its a private site and he can do what he wishes, but corgi was clueless. imagine what would happen if the HMC site disappeared for whatever reason tomorrow... i hope HM are paying him a backhander to have the site guaranteed up.

i think the jjds of the world are going after a customer base that has little in common with that of hobbymaster or corgi. i suspect jjds' customer base is older people and their increased production has come through effective marketing to such people. very few diecast shops that we recognize carry them and their ilk at all.

FS, I buy a fair number of JJD, K&C, Figarti, etc models ,and I have not seen anything from them than smacks of better marketing. Indeed, the same can be said for HM, Corgi, and others---what marketing? While we will never know for sure, I believe that there is an unknown degree of overlap between the three segments---high price/high quality brands, mainstream brands ( HM and Corgi ) and the cheapies--- In the latter case, based on their increasing production of "unusual subjects". I have noted many comments on this forum and others where posters admit that they chose a cheapie model over an HM or Corgi version mainly due to price. I can't give you a percentage, nor do I believe that the forums and their small cadres of posters necessarily represent a true sampling of all collectors but, in my experience, this is clearly a problem for HM and Corgi. Which is why I believe that if they can't beat the cheapie lines---which cater to more of a mass and less fussy market, then why not join them---but do it better by mixing in existing decent toolings already in hand with somewhat better than the norm cheapie add-ons?
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Old 05-01-2019, 08:41 PM   #24
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I'm of a more pessimistic view of the hobby, I'm afraid.
We have lost Witty, Gemini Aces & Dragon Warbirds- 3 of the key players in the diecast game.
JC has pretty much all the Witty toolings,...…...so those models are still in the game. The only one I am not sure about is the splendid Zero.

I could be wrong, but its my understanding the Gemini Aces toolings are still alive and that Gemini have in the past indicated that at least the Spey F4 is still in their plans?
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Old 05-01-2019, 08:47 PM   #25
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I add a thought i have about Corgi... even if i gave up WW2, i bought the Ju-52 over Crete, a no brainer for me.
But i find Corgi stucked with their moulds... any new moulds !
Again and again Ju-88, Ju-52, B-17, etc...


If no innovation by new mould... Corgi will crash
To be fair,.....the 1:48 Phantom is a pretty interesting new tooling. The Lightning has only had two releases thus far (I have both and they quality Diecast,...and I mean quality).

I think the Diecast planet was surprised they decided to tool the Beaufighter. No one saw that coming. Most pundits, including me thought the Hampden was going to be announced.

They updated a couple WW2 toolings as well.
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Old 05-01-2019, 08:52 PM   #26
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I do think also that 1/72 WW2 is dead or dying for single-engine types. collectors are getting older and eyesight gets worse. anybody with eyes can see you get a heck of a lot more model from HM's P-40Cs at $80 than their 1/72 P-40Es in 1/72 at $70 (the latter have not unsurprisingly dumped and may represent the end of HM's 1/72 single-engine WW2). the question is what about historic aircraft in general? or is it all modern jets from here on in?
Not dead. The line has been ruined with the cheapy magazine lines (along with Oxford).

Some toolings are still on fire though. The Pooch BF109 Gustav is still doing very well. HM's Helldivers, Avengers and pretty much all their Japanese stuff always do well. Its interesting because the PTO has a bit of a resurgence in recent years.

As you alluded through omission the Heavies and twins,..for the most part still sell very quickly.

But as you say, both HM's and Corgi's recent 1:72 P40 toolings have been very slow to clear.

I have to say though,......in some instances HM have not helped their cause with some WW2 toolings in 1:72. The A20 scheme selections are somewhat poorly thought out. The other problem with the A20 is the UK importer does not think much of them because they have been slow to clear. Part of the problem is HM's preference for WW2 schemes that are generally the same base colour

Still the recent Black pair did OK (could it be that a different base colour helped??) and finally a Invasion Striped Blighty based RAF 88 SQN A20 is coming. Which should been released long ago.

And of course the all the P40s released thus far have been the same base green. As opposed to the Pacific NMF, MTO RAF green/blue and Pacific Yellow,...that many of us have all been waiting for.
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Old 05-01-2019, 09:13 PM   #27
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The amount of manus has also shrunk in the past 5 years, we are down to what ? HM, JCW, Corgi (but with stickers and weird stands) and Calibre, anyone else is not producing models in any sort of quantity or quality to even bother mentioning.
Not sure that's right?

For instance Herpa have released the Porter and PC21, which are brand new toolings (both of which have or will have an Australian representation).

Air Commander - the latest F4D

Century Wings - The latest SR71 and prior to that was a A6.

AF1 - 1:72 heavies,....which is an impressive effort,...considering the Diecast planet always assumed that Corgi would be the only manufacturer to release such imposing models.

The list goes on (as I pointed out in my post). The fact that these manufacturers don't release in the quantity of HM (which you yourself claim should slow down some) does not mean they should be ignored when talking about the Hobby.

They are manufacturers who have a different method,..thats all. Their contribution is just as interesting and important to the Hobby has anyone.

I would bet a tenner if one of the manufacturers I have mentioned go broke it would be used as an example on the declining state of the Hobby. So in the same vein, their existence can and should be examples on the current state of the Hobby and its wonderful diversity.
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Old 05-01-2019, 10:06 PM   #28
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To be fair,.....the 1:48 Phantom is a pretty interesting new tooling. The Lightning has only had two releases thus far (I have both and they quality Diecast,...and I mean quality).
no disagreement there. i just dont think its enough to save corgi.


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I think the Diecast planet was surprised they decided to tool the Beaufighter. No one saw that coming. Most pundits, including me thought the Hampden was going to be announced.
neither of which is the tomcat, which would have made corgi millions had they done a competent job of it. but, they concentrated on parochial british subjects instead. which is great for collectors but was suicide from a long term business strategy.

it also stands to be said that corgi has 3 areas where they are still indisputably the leaders and where the market still has big potential:

- large ww2 1/72. nobody else comes close.
- ww1 1/48th-ish (1/50).
- 1/72 helicopters

unfortunately for the 3rd category, the market has never valued just how good corgi's releases have been and in all cases corgi unfortunately has to compete with itself in that any new release cannot be fully priced since for example it has to compete with widely available occasionally equally good or better older releases on ebay for a fraction of the new price.

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Old 05-01-2019, 10:07 PM   #29
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Air Commander - the latest F4D
that would be amazing if true. alas, it's the F-4D, not the F4D. Totally different aircraft.
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Old 05-02-2019, 12:14 AM   #30
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Cheesecake, you and I share almost identical background to collecting. Started around the same time but I started with Corgi (was a massive fan of them back in the day) then after many years I stopped getting props and moved to jets (which I originally swore I would never do lol) for me Dragon Armour came much later. They are a great example of top notch quality, they still survive today but are only a shadow of their former glory.

I too was driven by history and the aesthetics of aircraft. And for probably 10 out of the 15 years I've been collecting, I never researched a model or worry what I'd see when I opened the box, probably only in the last 5 years I start to take more of an interest in the accuracy and quality of models. I'm probably abit more forgiving on the technical aspects then Ladia (which I think is a credit to this hobby and his attempts to get manus to correct errors) but your right, areas I can't forgive is colour, scheme pattern and marking accuracy as well as quality of manufacture. And look if the last point was on point, then maybe the rest could be forgiven occasionally. If we were to go back and check the accuracy of all our models, well we'd probably have nothing. If you look at colour and markings, most will fail on one of those pointy but l the models generally look like the real aircraft, good enough.

I'm a huge fan of the Flogger but I just could not bring myself to get one no matter how much I would look at the photos and try to convince myself that it was never going to get any better. For our sake, I hope the Soviet shark mouth surprises us.

Scheme selection is what will ultimately make collectors finish. I guarantee you, ppl will collect the schemes they want no matter the price if it's put together well. HM doing polls is a great idea, if they can shake their reliance on copying decals.
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:16 AM   #31
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no disagreement there. i just dont think its enough to save corgi.

neither of which is the tomcat, which would have made corgi millions had they done a competent job of it. but, they concentrated on parochial british subjects instead. which is great for collectors but was suicide from a long term business strategy.

it also stands to be said that corgi has 3 areas where they are still indisputably the leaders and where the market still has big potential:

- large ww2 1/72. nobody else comes close.
- ww1 1/48th-ish (1/50).
- 1/72 helicopters

unfortunately for the 3rd category, the market has never valued just how good corgi's releases have been and in all cases corgi unfortunately has to compete with itself in that any new release cannot be fully priced since for example it has to compete with widely available occasionally equally good or better older releases on ebay for a fraction of the new price.
Not sure about the Tomcat,...that would make it 6th current manufacturer making the F14 (HM, CalWings, CW, JCWings and TSM). But I get your point. If the Corgi world was according to me,...….a 1:48 F16 would be the best bet.

Interesting points about the Corgi Helicopters and I pretty much agree. I personally just luv them,....although I have not bought many recent releases for the simple reason,...release after release of Blighty Helicopters, which has been the these past few years (since the US Blackhawks), is just not Diecast cricket,...in my view. In my view many of the Helicopter toolings have just been wasted and Corgi have done themselves no favours ignoring the rest of the international Diecast market.

And now they will pay the price for that narrow thinking with FoV multiple Chinook releases, including JASDF, RAF, ROKAF, RCAF, Australian Army and US Army releases of the Chinook. FoV are even going to release RAF's Bravo November from the Falklands.

Still,..the Gemini X Seaking is going to be splendid release (assuming they do a decent job of it) and I am really looking forward to adding that Chopper to my NASA theme. Its a damn shame they did not go all the way with a diorama like the splendid Apollo 11 effort.

Speaking of FoV. The 2019 release schedule has been updated. There is a lot of repeat schemes (which,...to me is odd) but with Waterson's taking over the line and building a new factory,...clearly Diecast is in their sights. With their pricing and new finishing techniques,...they are going to be fun to watch and collect in the years ahead.
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:23 AM   #32
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Just on a separate point.

Many of these conversations (and naval gazing exercises such as are regular occurrences on all the forums) many lads will comment through the prism of their collecting habits and themes.

Its not a criticism, it is, what it is, and in many ways its fair enough,...it is their collection after all.

However,...….it can shape their thoughts on the Hobby.

I myself are more into WW2 than anything else (although I collect pretty much everything and have dozens of themes). But I don't think the recent trend of WW2 fade is an indication of the overall health of the Hobby.

We must remember also the recent fade of WW2 single engine fighters is less about the lack of collectors but the massive surge in cheap magazine offerings that are steadily improving in quality. Not Corgi or HM quality but near enough when comparing respective pricing.
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:49 AM   #33
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Not sure about the Tomcat,...that would make it 6th current manufacturer making the F14 (HM, CalWings, CW, JCWings and TSM). But I get your point. If the Corgi world was according to me,...….a 1:48 F16 would be the best bet.
maybe i was unclear. i meant back before there was a HM, corgi was the quality leader and should have focused on a wider audience. instead, they left all of that to dragon and witty at the time, went parochial and small, and have suffered badly when a competent first rate competitor in HM came around.
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:58 AM   #34
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We must remember also the recent fade of WW2 single engine fighters is less about the lack of collectors but the massive surge in cheap magazine offerings that are steadily improving in quality. Not Corgi or HM quality but near enough when comparing respective pricing.
i've largely moved away from single engine small 1/72 ww2 stuff, but i'd be interested in seeing an example of magazine quality stuff which is 'close enough.' i've not seen anything that is 'near enough' with the exception of a few exceptional oxford releases which don't require fiddly bits like landing gear and weapons (such as their ar196 seaplane). i don't see a magazine mustang, spitfire, or anything else of the sort that i'd touch with a barge pole but maybe i've just not looked hard enough.

i did pick up a magazine fouga magister that was very acceptable and certainly better than the dassault house brand rubbish (premium-x or whtever they are called). but that 'magazine magister' was at leat 15 euro and i proably paid closer to 25 to have it shipped abroad to me. good model though.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:24 AM   #35
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maybe i was unclear. i meant back before there was a HM, corgi was the quality leader and should have focused on a wider audience. instead, they left all of that to dragon and witty at the time, went parochial and small, and have suffered badly when a competent first rate competitor in HM came around.
Oh,...…..fair enough. My mistake.

Still think a quality 1:48 F16 would be a winner for the venerable old Pooch.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:39 AM   #36
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i've largely moved away from single engine small 1/72 ww2 stuff, but i'd be interested in seeing an example of magazine quality stuff which is 'close enough.' i've not seen anything that is 'near enough' with the exception of a few exceptional oxford releases which don't require fiddly bits like landing gear and weapons (such as their ar196 seaplane). i don't see a magazine mustang, spitfire, or anything else of the sort that i'd touch with a barge pole but maybe i've just not looked hard enough.

i did pick up a magazine fouga magister that was very acceptable and certainly better than the dassault house brand rubbish (premium-x or whtever they are called). but that 'magazine magister' was at leat 15 euro and i proably paid closer to 25 to have it shipped abroad to me. good model though.
Have you seen the recent Deagostini magazine line?? Wonderful line including some quality twin engine Japanese Light Bombers/Heavy Fighters. This is not the most up to date list,...but many of them are new toolings.

Wonderful line,.....and was very popular subject over at the other forums.

1. Kawanishi N1K2 Shiden Kai "George"
2. Mitsubishi A6M5c Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
3. Bf109G
4. Nakajima Ki-43 Hyabusa "Oscar"
5. Mitsubishi J2M3 Raiden "Jack"
6. P-38J Lightning
7. Nakajima Ki-84 Hayate "Frank"
8. Kawasaki Ki-61 Hien "Tony"
9. Spitfire MkVb
10. Aichi B7A Ryusei "Grace"
11. Mitsubishi A6M2b Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
12. P-51D
13. F6F Hellcat
14. Aichi D3A1 Type 99 "Val"
15. Fw190D
16. F4U Corsair
17. Mitsubishi A7M2 Reppu "Sam"
18. F4F Wildcat
19. Mitsubishi A6M2a Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
20. Yokosuka D4Y Suisei "Judy"
21. P-40N Warhawk
22. Nakajima B5N "Kate"
23. Kyushu J7W1
24. Hurricane
25. Nakajima Ki-44 Shoki "Tojo"
26. Nakajima Ki-27 Type 97 "Nate"
27. Buffalo
28. Kawasaki Ki-100 Type 5 Goshikisen
29. Kawasaki Ki-45 Toryu "Nick"
30. MC.202 Folgore
31. Mitsubishi A6M3 Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
32. Yak-3
33. Mitsubishi Ki-46 "Dinah"
34. Me262
35. Hawker Typhoon
36. Mitsubishi J8M/Ki-200 Shusui
37. Dewoitine D.520
38. Mitsubishi A5M Type 96 "Claude"
39. P-47D
40. Mitsubishi A6M2b Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
41. Bf109K-4
42. SBD Dauntless
43. Boulton Paul defiant
44. Nakajima A6M2-N floatplane "Rufe"
45. Ju87D
46. P-39 Airacobra
47. Aichi E13A1 floatplane "Jake"
48. Fw190A
49. F4U Corsair
50. Aichi M6A1 Seiran floatplane
51. Bf110
52. Mitsubishi F1M2 floatplane "Pete"
53. Polikarpov I-16
54. TBM Avenger
55. Nakajima C6N1 Saiun "Myrt"
56. Mitsubishi A6M5c Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
57. Fiat G.55 Centauro
58. Aichi D3A1 "Val"
59. He-162
60. Nakajima B6N Tenzan "Jill"
61. Morane Saulnier MS.406
62. P-51D
63. DH Mosquito
64. Mitsubishi A6M2b Zero "Zeke/Hamp"
65. F6F Hellcat
66. Do.335
67. Yak-9
68. Bf109K
69. Kawasaki Ki-61 Hien "Tony"
70. Fw190D
71. P-40N
72. Nakajima Ki-43 Hayabusa "Oscar"
73. Ju87G
74. P-47D
75. Nakajima B5N2 "Kate"
76. Me262
77. Mitsubishi J2M3 Raiden "Jack" in captured US livery
78. P-51D
79. MC.205 Veltro
80. Lavochkin La-7
81. Mitsubishi F1M "Pete"
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:58 AM   #37
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Oh,...…..fair enough. My mistake.

Still think a quality 1:48 F16 would be a winner for the venerable old Pooch.
a steady stream of quality 1/48 releases indeed may be a new niche for them. i'm a bit skeptical, but, well, i do love me 1/48 and if they can do it, great.

however, as above expectations as the 1/48 ee lightning is, it still comes with a really underdetailed cockpit. this makes it hard to recommend. on most 1/48 models, hm has likewise done poor cockpits but at least those are barely visible - on jets with big canopies the deficiencies become much more obvious. the cockpit is the face of an airplane. its where the eyes go and i think corgi with their phantom and hm with their hawk would be wise to spend some money to really improve those as it is the one place that code3ers really cant adequately get into. if corgi put 20$ into each cockpit of their $150-$170 lightnings, i'd think they'd have something really really special and if they wanted to be even really cooler they'd do some low power led lighting for the cockpit and exterior lights. some people will complain that it's toylike, but if done subtly it could add a lot of perceived value.

as far as you list of deagostini stuff goes - i think i have seen some of those and wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. can you recommend one in particular that you think is particularly good so that i can re-evaluate?

i have about 50 of those magazine aircraft in a box somewhere in another country.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:05 AM   #38
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as far as you list of deagostini stuff goes - i think i have seen some of those and wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. can you recommend one in particular that you think is particularly good so that i can re-evaluate?

i have about 50 of those magazine aircraft in a box somewhere in another country.
Here is a link from Ebay,..with plenty of pictures. I personnaly have not gotten crazy over the line (which I kinda regret),.....just picking of Japanese stuff that takes my fancy,....like the Dinah.

There is a whole thread with reviews on most of the releases over at MHIII.

https://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_...c&LH_PrefLoc=2

You got to remember,..they are not HM/Corgi quality, but for value for money they beat up on the Corgi/HM by a fair margin.

But when you look at the link,....you will see what they did go for and what many of them go for now. The series is called: Deagostini WWII Masterpiece Aircraft Collection
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:24 AM   #39
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ah yes - i've had these in my hand in tokyo last week. the shosen book tower in akihabara has a good number in stock at any given point.

i guess corgi 1/72 are about the bottom for me of what i consider acceptable, again, except for certain exceptional cases like floatplanes in some instances. and, i've yet to find a corgi 1/72 single engine model that can't be had for around 20 pounds. and the HM 1/72 p40e is now selling at a a major uk retailer for 20 pounds less 10%. i've moved on to built kits in 1/48 for the japanese stuff i like. so, i guess if these magazine models are good for some - and certainly for epap for example they are - for me i'm not keen. i think if i were to go small there's better variety, value, and models to be had in 1/144 from japan - in everything from expensive metal in 1/144 to quite cheap very very good stuff from f-toys, wing club, and the like.

in fact, if i was interested in the widest variety of good models for the cheapest price possible, 1/144 is clearly the way to go, though we rarely if every discuss those lines here in the west.
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:04 AM   #40
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LFT, I'm glad you noted the deAgostini Japanese series now playing out and available via Hobby Link Japan and eBay sources. This is a perfect example of how the partwork lines can add many "unusual subjects" to a collectionj while affording enough quality to allow for decent code 3 work and, in many cases the models can be accepted in "as is" form. Since this is an IXO-based line most of the planes in the series are based on existing IXO molds and often use the same schemes with the same errors and those awful black inked panel lines. Nevertheless quite a few now toolings---all of Japanese planes---- were included. Here are some examples. First, a Rufe:

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Old 05-02-2019, 11:06 AM   #41
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And my version with some staining and other small refinements:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:07 AM   #42
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A Reppu---the intended Zero replacement. I left this one alone:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:09 AM   #43
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A Jill---not bad but the green is way too dark:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:09 AM   #44
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So I redid it:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:11 AM   #45
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Same issue with the Saiun:

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Old 05-02-2019, 11:12 AM   #46
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Same Fix:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:13 AM   #47
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The DeA Claude---not bad:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:14 AM   #48
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The DeA Nick---not bad except for those gigantic spinners:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:14 AM   #49
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One of my code 3 Nicks with the correct spinners:
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:16 AM   #50
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The DeA Dinah---not bad except for a badly done tail wheel:
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