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Old 12-21-2016, 06:25 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Hobby Master Colour Issues

Original version of duck egg blue



Mid version of duck egg blue, acceptable but not great



Latest version of duck egg blue, looking more like robins egg blue and starting to become unacceptable

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Old 12-21-2016, 06:44 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Photo taken on a duck egg blue table from Ikea showing models under the same lighting conditions.

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Old 12-21-2016, 07:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Real life examples of what we should be getting





And here is a comparison between real life and what we get, as you can see, there worlds apart



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Old 12-21-2016, 07:45 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Yep all colours of the model appear to be a bit darker than the actual real aircraft colour...disappointing.
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Old 12-21-2016, 07:49 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Why did they used to be able to get it right, for years, then just lose it so badly??

That is what puzzles me. Where did this garish horrorshow even come from?
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Old 12-21-2016, 08:21 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Change of factory ? Change in management ? But that's still no excuse though.

My suggestion is, unless your happy with the current level of quality, speak up and let HM know that this needs to be corrected.

Only the diecast gods know why HM got it right then chose to get it wrong thereafter.
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Old 12-22-2016, 06:06 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Yeah, got the ANG F-16's and the paint is so dark it's terrible with the dark grey. Between the high contrast grey colors and the added blue tones, HM has sucked with many models as of late. The paint tones are more toy like than a collectors piece. A shame HM is willing to let so many poorly painted models out on the market this year.
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Old 12-22-2016, 10:44 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Mig-23 isn´t aircraft I´m interested in, but of course I can deeply understand your disappointment, especially because such mistake could have been easily preventable.

From the above reason I wasn´t following all threads about Mig-23 on DA.C forum, so I can be easily mistaken, anyway by quick search I found that first pre-production photo of HA5302 was posted by Eagle Flyer on 06-20-2016 in this post. Excuse my ignorance, but let me ask: has someone pointed out incorrect underside color since then? Or reported it to William? Because if not, it can well be that this particular coloring issue is actually also our fault - partly...
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Old 12-22-2016, 11:46 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Probably no one bothered to correct the first two floggers because there not really what anyone's after and in any case, HM put the Libyian Flogger straight into production without pre pros so we couldn't correct even if we wanted to.

I will however email HM about my concerns, the problem is, once they have produced a batch of incorrect blanks, they still want to use them anyway.

And with the Topcats Viking, a few of us emailed HM well before the pre pro stage and still they persisted to continue with the errors.

Both of the last Fishbeds were finals as well and HM even delayed the photos on purpose so that some sales would push through before releasing how bad they really were.

At the end of the day, I'll be voting with my wallet if contacting them proves to be a waste of time.
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Old 12-23-2016, 12:49 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

I have one HM model on pre-order right now. I just received the ANG F-16 this week and the P-51 and with both having issues, I will not pre-order HM models from this point forward unless they start posting the pre-pos again and address issues. I am code-3ing the F-16 and I will eBay the P-51.
Tired of getting burned and tired of paying higher prices for lower quality models. Anew production facility is not going to help HM, watching the quality of their products will and listening to their customer base is what gained my purchases in the past. That's what it will take in the future as there are other places to spend my money.
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Old 12-23-2016, 02:58 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Sorry to hear you had issues Trip, bl00dy annoying I know

IMHO HM are dangerously adopting a shut up and buy it attitude, being sneaky and not showing photos of the product or going straight to production without pre pros because they know theres an issue collectors would address if given the chance.

It's like FFS it's not rocket science, there's plenty on reference material out there to get it right !! And failing that, can they stop scratching the **** out of models too, we're not paying good money for stuff to get dropped on the floor or stacked up on top of each other !

Although Red Falcons mould looks abit toy like compared to HM's, at least they got the basics right, HM just had to look at google, look at this model and go yep, that's what we need to do, not this hello kitty hyper bright or dark crap their coming out with

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Old 12-23-2016, 02:59 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by tker76 View Post
Why did they used to be able to get it right, for years, then just lose it so badly??

That is what puzzles me. Where did this garish horrorshow even come from?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukrainian_Falcons View Post
Change of factory ? Change in management ? But that's still no excuse though.

My suggestion is, unless your happy with the current level of quality, speak up and let HM know that this needs to be corrected.

Only the diecast gods know why HM got it right then chose to get it wrong thereafter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripoli View Post
Yeah, got the ANG F-16's and the paint is so dark it's terrible with the dark grey. Between the high contrast grey colors and the added blue tones, HM has sucked with many models as of late. The paint tones are more toy like than a collectors piece. A shame HM is willing to let so many poorly painted models out on the market this year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukrainian_Falcons View Post
Probably no one bothered to correct the first two floggers because there not really what anyone's after and in any case, HM put the Libyian Flogger straight into production without pre pros so we couldn't correct even if we wanted to.

I will however email HM about my concerns, the problem is, once they have produced a batch of incorrect blanks, they still want to use them anyway.

And with the Topcats Viking, a few of us emailed HM well before the pre pro stage and still they persisted to continue with the errors.

Both of the last Fishbeds were finals as well and HM even delayed the photos on purpose so that some sales would push through before releasing how bad they really were.

At the end of the day, I'll be voting with my wallet if contacting them proves to be a waste of time.
It's been most of their models lately with the colours issues, & they go ahead even if anything's said because we don't get to see the pre-pro's anymore, & even if we do, our concerns are ignored now.

Quote:
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I have one HM model on pre-order right now. I just received the ANG F-16 this week and the P-51 and with both having issues, I will not pre-order HM models from this point forward unless they start posting the pre-pos again and address issues. I am code-3ing the F-16 and I will eBay the P-51.
Tired of getting burned and tired of paying higher prices for lower quality models. Anew production facility is not going to help HM, watching the quality of their products will and listening to their customer base is what gained my purchases in the past. That's what it will take in the future as there are other places to spend my money.
This is why I won't take a chance pre-ordering, or even buy online, at least not until I've seen the model in the metal. It is also the reason why I have bought only 2 of HM's planes in the past 2 years compared with 5 of Corgi's.
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Old 12-23-2016, 05:12 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Hmm, it looks to me that they use the right colors for the models but don't use scale coloring, a very known painting technique in making plastic kits.
Here is a link which explains it a little bit.

http://www.arcair.com/tnt1/001-100/T...Colour/00.shtm
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Old 12-23-2016, 08:23 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

It's not an issue of scaling.
The USAF does not paint their F-15 with blue at all. The F-22 uses a ram coating that is a set of three shades of grey, not green blue and grey. The USAF does not use high contrast colors on their aircraft as they want colors to blend and not stick out. Like the P-51, HM reversed colors on some of the applications.

No, not scaling as a issue, just flat out poor choices and workmanship lately.
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Old 12-23-2016, 08:30 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

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Originally Posted by tripoli View Post
I have one HM model on pre-order right now. I just received the ANG F-16 this week and the P-51 and with both having issues, I will not pre-order HM models from this point forward unless they start posting the pre-pos again and address issues. I am code-3ing the F-16 and I will eBay the P-51.
Tired of getting burned and tired of paying higher prices for lower quality models. Anew production facility is not going to help HM, watching the quality of their products will and listening to their customer base is what gained my purchases in the past. That's what it will take in the future as there are other places to spend my money.

To be fair, not only HM makes lower quality models nowadays. Look at "high-end" Century Wings Anniversary F-14 - out of four pieces only one has acceptable quality, many pieces have deep scratches after some rasp under the canopy, then look at the recent JC Wings F-14 issue mentioned by StillAir, I have seen heavily oversprayed Herpa´s SU-30MKK "Pavel Osipovich Sukhoi" reminding me overspraying of AF1 splitter camo SU-35s etc etc. Maybe only Corgi has less quality issues in these days? With HM we can at least communicate, thanks to William ... but despite this still new and new mistakes occur on new HM releases.

Looks like the overal quality of diecast models slightly worsened compared to some 4- 5 years ago. Unfortunately I do not see much chances to improve this, since in the end all models are sold - some of them sooner, some of them later, but sold out, quality better or worse. That means that even the low quality pieces someone finally buys and doesn´t return them to the seller. Remember that all the collectors on this forum are just a very tiny fraction of total diecast market and many buyers just don´t care about issues or accept them.

For me it would be nice, at the moment, if we could have ALL HM pre-pro photos, if the link HM - Dave - DA.C forum works fluently, with actively asking Dave or HM in case that the pre-pros are not available in time, since many potential issues can be remedied easily at this stage. And lot of mistakes already have been corrected over the time thanks to this great possibility.
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Old 12-23-2016, 10:41 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by tripoli View Post
It's not an issue of scaling.
The USAF does not paint their F-15 with blue at all. The F-22 uses a ram coating that is a set of three shades of grey, not green blue and grey. The USAF does not use high contrast colors on their aircraft as they want colors to blend and not stick out. Like the P-51, HM reversed colors on some of the applications.

No, not scaling as a issue, just flat out poor choices and workmanship lately.
Exactly, Jeff- couldn't have put it better myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladia View Post
To be fair, not only HM makes lower quality models nowadays. Look at "high-end" Century Wings Anniversary F-14 - out of four pieces only one has acceptable quality, many pieces have deep scratches after some rasp under the canopy, then look at the recent JC Wings F-14 issue mentioned by StillAir, I have seen heavily oversprayed Herpa´s SU-30MKK "Pavel Osipovich Sukhoi" reminding me overspraying of AF1 splitter camo SU-35s etc etc. Maybe only Corgi has less quality issues in these days? With HM we can at least communicate, thanks to William ... but despite this still new and new mistakes occur on new HM releases.

Looks like the overal quality of diecast models slightly worsened compared to some 4- 5 years ago. Unfortunately I do not see much chances to improve this, since in the end all models are sold - some of them sooner, some of them later, but sold out, quality better or worse. That means that even the low quality pieces someone finally buys and doesn´t return them to the seller. Remember that all the collectors on this forum are just a very tiny fraction of total diecast market and many buyers just don´t care about issues or accept them.

For me it would be nice, at the moment, if we could have ALL HM pre-pro photos, if the link HM - Dave - DA.C forum works fluently, with actively asking Dave or HM in case that the pre-pros are not available in time, since many potential issues can be remedied easily at this stage. And lot of mistakes already have been corrected over the time thanks to this great possibility.
It does seem as if Corgi & Oxford Blue Box are notable exceptions to the rule where quality & accuracy are concerned these days, the others all having issues in both areas.
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Old 12-23-2016, 11:38 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

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Unfortunately I do not see much chances to improve this, since in the end all models are sold - some of them sooner, some of them later, but sold out, quality better or worse. That means that even the low quality pieces someone finally buys and doesn´t return them to the seller. Remember that all the collectors on this forum are just a very tiny fraction of total diecast market and many buyers just don´t care about issues or accept them.
Yes that is true to a certain extent. It's all about whether the brand is making any money. You could have one model that sells poorly but the loss is offset by the models that do sell well. Where they may start running into trouble is consistently producing poor selling models, then the retailer becomes fed up of losing money and refuses to stock that brand any more. Without retailers, the manufacturer has no cost effective way of selling their models.

...and referring to the statement about collectors on the forum, yes I agree it probably only represents a small portion of the diecast collecting community. There is also the possibility many collectors aren't aware of errors as all they want to do is buy diecast planes and put them on the display shelf. Whether an F-16 should have a large intake or a small one isn't something they know or perhaps even want to know.
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Old 12-23-2016, 12:17 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Yes that is true to a certain extent. It's all about whether the brand is making any money. You could have one model that sells poorly but the loss is offset by the models that do sell well. Where they may start running into trouble is consistently producing poor selling models, then the retailer becomes fed up of losing money and refuses to stock that brand any more. Without retailers, the manufacturer has no cost effective way of selling their models.

Yes, actually this is probably the only possibility how to push on producers who are consistently making poor quality models: with low sales the retailers should inform producers about reasons, and retailers maybe finaly refuse to stock that brand any more. But such scenario is usable maybe for AF1 or other brands notoriously known for low quality products, for major brands retailers will maybe only order less pieces. Anyway i believe that only the market as a whole can really push for any fundamental change. Which is quite hard to accomplish.
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Old 12-23-2016, 12:19 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

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I have one HM model on pre-order right now. I just received the ANG F-16 this week and the P-51 and with both having issues, I will not pre-order HM models from this point forward unless they start posting the pre-pos again and address issues. I am code-3ing the F-16 and I will eBay the P-51.
Tired of getting burned and tired of paying higher prices for lower quality models. Anew production facility is not going to help HM, watching the quality of their products will and listening to their customer base is what gained my purchases in the past. That's what it will take in the future as there are other places to spend my money.
So no more comments on models then since you wont be buying or having any interest in them?
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Old 12-23-2016, 05:39 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

I certainly will purchase less or. code 3 them...



Or, expand the collecting to other manufacturers and items...



Dam Toys SR-71 figures are expensive but nice.

Or... I have a set of a signature Bud Anderson P-51D (excellent condition) and Glamorous Glennis (unopened) selling together cheap if anyone is interested. $ 100 shipped Conus, helps get another pilot figure.
Just weeding out to purchase some non HM aviation items.
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Last edited by tripoli; 12-23-2016 at 06:13 PM.
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Old 12-23-2016, 06:00 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Since HM have decided to finally make another Camo Flogger, I think it's good to see how they usually turn out. Now I'd say that the Syrian drawing is on the money but things change, you know, factory screws up, excuses, generally don't GAF about making quality collector models.

The real deal



HM drawing (even this is wrong)



The final mess



So when HM can't even replicate their own drawning, what hope do we have. Also it's interesting to note on the real photo how many markings there are on floggers yet HM's are as bare as a matchbox toy.

Agreed that while we chose not to return these models, the problem will never go away, I'm sure these manus play on the fact that most ppl buy these online and therefore returning is not always an option. Buy from a store or locally or from an online retailer that has a good shipping policy. I should have returned that Egyptian Fishbed but return shipping would be insane. Lesson learnt, no more buying models when HM are hiding final photos.
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Old 12-23-2016, 07:50 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Agreed that while we chose not to return these models, the problem will never go away, I'm sure these manus play on the fact that most ppl buy these online and therefore returning is not always an option. Buy from a store or locally or from an online retailer that has a good shipping policy. I should have returned that Egyptian Fishbed but return shipping would be insane. Lesson learnt, no more buying models when HM are hiding final photos.

Just one note:
imho i believe that no retailer will accept returns only from the reason that buyer don´t like the particular color or colors are incorrect.
Or do they?
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Old 12-23-2016, 07:58 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

" i believe that no retailer will accept returns only from the reason that buyer don´t like the particular color or colors are incorrect.
Or do they? "

No, that would be their worst nightmare, having to take on the cost for a different business's screw up. Doing that would put most of those suppliers out of business. That is not fair to retailers.
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Old 12-23-2016, 08:48 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

They probably won't even though most countries would have consumer law that states that if a final produce is not the same as what was advertised, you are within your rights to return it, the tricky thing is, getting them to man up and take responsibility, most dealers will sell any old garbage these days and not accept the return. Don't think they don't know which products are like insta-returns.

However if a model is damaged by the factory which happens a lot with HM, you should be able to return it.

Its been pretty obvious for awhile now that HM intentionally withhold photos because of issues with their models. From now on I won't be making the same mistake of buying blindly, theres always another dealer out their somewhere that will have it in stock for a lot longer so I'll be waiting for when real photos come out and save me the trouble of dealing with HM's BS.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:14 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

ow one color of this paint scheme is not an exact match
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Old 03-25-2017, 11:48 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Well sadly since this topic was started, HM have shown us the Syrian Flogger pre pro photos and it's once again nothing like what was presented in the original release drawing which would have made this release an Insta-buy.

But HM are not alone, JCW seem to be struggling with colours AND camo patterns, until collectors vote with their wallet, this will continue to occur.

The Syrian Flogger is the 4th model this year that I've knocked back because of issues
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Old 12-02-2017, 01:11 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Noticed the latest Floggers have issues with off centre tails. Also brown on the wings and air intakes are much lighter then brown the rest of the model



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Old 12-02-2017, 01:53 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

the colour issue boils down to the different material on which the paint is applied i.e. plastics vs diecast alloy. as for the vertical stab... it was probably a returned model that hc chose to display.
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Old 12-02-2017, 03:17 AM   #29 (permalink)
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the colour issue boils down to the different material on which the paint is applied i.e. plastics vs diecast alloy. as for the vertical stab... it was probably a returned model that hc chose to display.
Apologist excuse more like the parts are made in a different factory and the muppets wouldn't use the same paint, not good enough on a $170 model.

In that case, everything at Hobby Co from HM is a return
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Old 12-02-2017, 03:27 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

Gonna love the attention to detail from the staff at HC. Gears on the Arab Fishbed are the wrong way around

Also price of the latest Fishbeds have jumped $20-30, that mould is outdated now, time for a seamless fuseagle if ya gonna charge that much for 300 grams of zinc
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Old 12-02-2017, 10:25 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Apologist excuse more like the parts are made in a different factory and the muppets wouldn't use the same paint, not good enough on a $170 model.

In that case, everything at Hobby Co from HM is a return
and you know this how? you've been to the different factories?

yes, if all aussie collectors were as picky as you then i'm sure hobbyco would've had their hands full with rejects

Quote:
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Gonna love the attention to detail from the staff at HC. Gears on the Arab Fishbed are the wrong way around

Also price of the latest Fishbeds have jumped $20-30, that mould is outdated now, time for a seamless fuseagle if ya gonna charge that much for 300 grams of zinc
fishbeds weigh 300 grams eh? ever inching towards my first free zero...
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Old 12-02-2017, 10:33 AM   #32 (permalink)
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- duplicate post -
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Old 12-02-2017, 10:37 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: Hobby Master Colour Issues

With the Russian models coming out, hopefully HM can use all that blue paint correctly now.
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Old 12-02-2017, 11:53 AM   #34 (permalink)
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With the Russian models coming out, hopefully HM can use all that blue paint correctly now.
haven't they already? and yet there are still those who sing the blues...
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