Whoa, looks like it was getting trashed so badly at the HM Hangar Pub site the mods may have deleted the thread. Hot subject now that HM has screwed this one up yet again.
Whoa, looks like it was getting trashed so badly at the HM Hangar Pub site the mods may have deleted the thread. Hot subject now that HM has screwed this one up yet again.
Sorry Jeff - no conspiracy theory there.
It was my thread and I tried to add a photo (as I did to the thread here). Unfortunately the DHP board only posted it as a link to my entire photobucket library - and wouldn't let me edit it out. So I had no choice but to to restart the thread.
I'm gonna wait and see. I buy what I like. I didn't mind the A model. My collection is around 50 aircraft displayed. Do I like the bumps....not really. Are they so horrible that I can't take it...no. I'm also fond of my WW F-15 Aggresors and my WW SU's. I realize that not everyone will be on board with this, but as they say "It is what it is". The cost of creating a new mold was probably cost prohibitive, especially with AF1 copying every model that HM makes. HM needed to stay I the game and keep up. This model will sell because frankly, it's our only choice unless you want AF1. For what it's worth, I buy these models with the money i make flying, so I take it with a grain of salt.
I strongly disagree. If we start putting our hard earned money down for poorly executed models then it sets the precedent that we're okay with that. If you are, that's fine. I am not. There's no chance I'll be adding a HM F-35 to my collection. It's one of the worst models on the market.
I strongly disagree. If we start putting our hard earned money down for poorly executed models then it sets the precedent that we're okay with that. If you are, that's fine. I am not. There's no chance I'll be adding a HM F-35 to my collection. It's one of the worst models on the market.
It's ok to disagree. Everyone ( most everyone ) works hard for their money. I feel there is an undercurrent of resentment against those who don't mind the model. It's not my favorite, but I don't mind it. I think it displays well with the others that I have. If I sent William an email expressing my desire to have it changed I would get the same response as the hundreds who already have. Let's face it, the deal is done. It's going to boil down to wether you can tolerate it or not. This may well be the catalyst needed to bring in another player. Again, the F-35 is the only new a/c we are gonna see for a while. I would like to see a Rafalė or Gripen as well but those options are limited.
I stared at that model for 10 minutes today from 3 feet away and tried to get the lines to bother me......couldn't do it. I really think this is a major over reaction. The model itself ...at least the "A" model, isn't that horrible. Yeah I would like it if the lines were smooth. I think this is more about the fact that we only have one airplane to look forward to for the next 10-20 years, and most collectors don't want this particular one to be the end game.
I stared at that model for 10 minutes today from 3 feet away and tried to get the lines to bother me......couldn't do it. I really think this is a major over reaction. The model itself ...at least the "A" model, isn't that horrible. Yeah I would like it if the lines were smooth. I think this is more about the fact that we only have one airplane to look forward to for the next 10-20 years, and most collectors don't want this particular one to be the end game.
The bumps on the model aside, it's just not a good looking aircraft.
And yeah, once everything else retires and we are just left with this aircraft to collect, that'll be the death of this hobby
Look at it side by side with the F-22 and you'll realize just how bad this model really is. The bumps, the join lines, the overall shape... it's just not well executed.
I have to agree that no one should buy this POS or it sets a precedent that you guys will accept this in the future.
It makes no sense why this model has protruding panel lines.
If it was 1:400 maybe I could understand.
How a 1:200 Herpa looks better than a 1:72 should be an embarrassment enough to justify a new mold.
I disagree. I've always liked the lines of the F-35. Kind of a 'mini-me' F-22. FAR better looking an aircraft than the alternative would have been...
That said, it is a bit wide, a shape dictated by the need to include provisions for a lift fan and roll posts for the VSTOL version.
Oh, and HM did cok it up with the paneling. I'm sorry, but they did. The panels are indeed there, but they're not the braille execution HM pulled off. I think the vert stabs are the perfect example of this...the lines are there, but they're flush, not bumpy like HM presented it. AF1 did a much better job with that example.
I do have the HM F-35A AF-1 (the one with all the flags and LockMart markings on it), and it's a nice little model, glad I picked it up on a sale at the 'Mule. I might have felt ripped off at the full price point.
At least they appear to have done a much better job with the nozzle with the -B model than they did with the -A.
i still prefer my jets sleek and there's something about the legacy jets that just makes me go wow! which of you didn't go wow! the first time you saw the awesomeness of the blackbird and nighthawk?
Its not the model that turns me off, its the aircraft itself that I have an aversion too.
It lacks historical context. Like the F22 (which I have one) it really does not float my boat. Also compared the the F15/F14 etc, it has terrible looks.
I'll get the RAAF 2OCU and I'll probably pick up other....but on discount.
Let's face it there has been no shortage of 'ugly' aircraft that people are willing to collect. I doubt the A6 or A7 would win many beauty pageants. The A 10 was unofficially called Warthog for a reason too. That said the HM F35 could be improved, a lot.
Let's face it there has been no shortage of 'ugly' aircraft that people are willing to collect. I doubt the A6 or A7 would win many beauty pageants. The A 10 was unofficially called Warthog for a reason too. That said the HM F35 could be improved, a lot.
The things those aircraft had in common were they were badass, especially the A-10, the F-35 on the other hand does not have that badassness nor stealthiness to it, it just looks like the laughing stock of the airforce
The F-35 is more likely to bring down enemy planes with it's ugliness, blinding enemy pilots then the need to shoot missiles to score a "kill"
The F-35 is more likely to bring down enemy planes with it's ugliness, blinding enemy pilots then the need to shoot missiles to score a "kill"
Similar sentiments but in reverse regarding the YF-23, the USAF could've employed it to seduce enemy aircraft with its beauty while taking the first shot.
Let's face it there has been no shortage of 'ugly' aircraft that people are willing to collect. I doubt the A6 or A7 would win many beauty pageants. The A 10 was unofficially called Warthog for a reason too. That said the HM F35 could be improved, a lot.
No, the A10 is not pretty. But it is one of the most interesting and menacing looking aircraft ever.
yes but while the A-10 has a massive 30mm gattling to offset the ugliness not to mention the awe and high regard of the A-10, the F-35 does not have many distinguishing features.
Let's face it there has been no shortage of 'ugly' aircraft that people are willing to collect. I doubt the A6 or A7 would win many beauty pageants. The A 10 was unofficially called Warthog for a reason too. That said the HM F35 could be improved, a lot.
i don't think the A-7 corsair is particularly ugly- i certainly don't agree with it's nickname 'SLUF' (short little ugly f*cker). & the A-10 is ugly in a menacing way.
The F-8 isn't the prettiest, but it was the best pure fighter of the Vietnam war. It had the highest kill ratio ( ironically with missles ). When your out of F-8's, Your out of fighters.
I love the A-6, A-7, A-10, and F-8. All of those jets have an aggressive look to them. They aren't sports cars, they are mean military machines. I also love the S-3 Viking.
I love the A-6, A-7, A-10, and F-8. All of those jets have an aggressive look to them. They aren't sports cars, they are mean military machines. I also love the S-3 Viking.
That is a pretty ugly plane. Looks like a Walrus! I don't actually mind the A7 & A10 (I've got one of each) and I'll probably pick up a A6 at some point. I always thought of the F8 as the A7's better looking brother. But it will be a cold day in hell before I purchase a F101 Voodoo!
I strongly disagree. If we start putting our hard earned money down for poorly executed models then it sets the precedent that we're okay with that. If you are, that's fine. I am not. There's no chance I'll be adding a HM F-35 to my collection. It's one of the worst models on the market.
I could not have said it better. If this carp sells then that's it for good quality models. They can make whatever they want and get away with it. Disgusting!
I could not have said it better. If this carp sells then that's it for good quality models. They can make whatever they want and get away with it. Disgusting!
Soooooo what about those us who don't mind it? Are we supposed to join this coalition or be ostracized from the diecast community ?
Not ostracized from the community. No one can dictate what you can or should do. You have every right to do what you want. But, you send a message to HM that if it sells, they can make a bad product no matter what.
Still see the paneling lines with the photos, especially in the lower fuselage, HM has not changed a thing concerning the issue that killed the first F-35 model. HM could have made the changes in the molds the first time around but passed and again had the chance with this model knowing beyond a doubt that it was an issue with collectors.
Given they are going with this a second time around, it's apparent that HM priority on accuracy and detailing is being pushed back for fiscal reasons. It was a bad decision the first time, there is no excuse for the second time.
It's a very bad sign of how HM sees itself going forward into the future with their models. They stuck on making this model, accepting a known bad detail accuracy issue for the sake of saving money.
If that is how HM wants people to view them, fine, but it's a losing business strategy. It hits hard at their reputation for making great models and it opens the door for others to take that market niche, something we are starting to see already. It's a foolish decision, stupid as they know better but are still going ahead with it.
It's never prudent to make a bad product, collectors supporting such sends a message to HM that they can continue to degrade their products in the future. I can't stand for such and anyone that truly supports HM should not do so either. It is a POS model with a glaring detail error, HM can do better.
Dan has noted that the first F-35 models have sold extremely well, so with strong sales, William chooses not to listen the second time around. Money talks with HM. The hard core collectors in the forum here make up a small percentage of the overall sales. So it seems the only manner in which you will evoke a change is to scream loudly or en mass not purchase the product and hope that is enough to get William's attention.
Neither is a good hope unless collectors really make themselves heard one way or another. Sad to see this happening frankly, I though William and HM was better than this and have been proven wrong with this model.
Unfortunately the masses outweigh the true collectors and we will be subject to their purchases. If the model drops, it will just get more people to buy it. I had strong hopes for the "B" even though I think it's the albatross of the airplane in general. Personally, I wanted this model for my collection and in my opinion it was the best available. I did have higher hopes for it. It's hard to put a dress on a pig they say. The F-35 is just a plain looking aircraft. It's a compromise in the most expensive way. Anything short of shooting down the mothership in "Independence Day" would be a disappointment after how much it cost.
I could not have said it better. If this carp sells then that's it for good quality models. They can make whatever they want and get away with it. Disgusting!
It might mean that to the buying public both subject and execution matters. There have been many decent models which have sold unprofitably. I don't see SkyMax around any more.
It might mean that to the buying public both subject and execution matters. There have been many decent models which have sold unprofitably. I don't see SkyMax around any more.
Exactly!!
I have been saying for an age, the accuracy of a model is way down the list on the reasons why the "masses" buy a model.
Price
Aircraft type
Era, Theatre
Scheme
Nation the model represents
Then...maybe accuracy.
It has always been thus.
Some of the stuff about who or what HM cares about is getting a bit out there.
There have always been bad models and there have always been good, even great models. Across the broad spectrum of good and the bad, all have had their fair share of dumping or manufacturers going broke.....including Corgi...........twice!!
Last edited by PBRStreetgang; 03-12-2015 at 11:03 PM.
How about a carefully composed, polite letter on behalf of the members of this board to William? We could do the same thing for our sister sites. It might make a huge difference as opposed to several people sending many emails. I would even pay more $$ for a more authentic version of the model. CW needs to get on the ball too. We all love Tomcats, but it's time for a new bird. Prowler. Perhaps in Low Vis? That would be right their alley.
A letter from the boards might be a good idea, just implementing it an issue.
As for CW, I would suggest a S-3 Viking. Fits with their other aircraft, has not been produced yet, has a ton of liveries and needs to be done correctly, something Yoshi would do justice to.
How about a carefully composed, polite letter on behalf of the members of this board to William? We could do the same thing for our sister sites. It might make a huge difference as opposed to several people sending many emails. I would even pay more $$ for a more authentic version of the model. CW needs to get on the ball too. We all love Tomcats, but it's time for a new bird. Predator Perhaps in Low Vis? That would be right their alley.
The entire issue regarding HM's F-35 is that some collectors disagree with the interpretation of the panel lines on the upper fuselage.
That is all. The shape of the model and other details are not being criticized.
My opinion is that once you see the model in person the panel lines are really a non issue.
Now, total production of HM's first two versions of the F-35A has totalled 4,800 (3,300 HA4401 and 1,500 HA4402). These are huge numbers considering today's typical numbers for a Hobby Master release is 700 or less.
Retailer feedback has been nothing but positive regarding this model (especially selling very well among first time buyers) and have commented that they haven't seen such high demand in the last five years. One distributor noted that they sold 500 and could have easily sold 1,000.
As noted by Christian (PBRStreetgang) both HA4401 and HA4402 are no longer available at the Flying Mule.
So there you have it. Despite the criticism from a handful of collectors (all forums included perhaps 20 people) - this model has been an unqualified success for HM.
Production for the first two F-35Bs is planned on being 4,000. So if sales of the "A" version were a problem, production of the "B" version would be a fraction of that.
With a $80,000 cost of producing a tooling there is absolutely no way HM was going to the expense of changing the mould. Besides, why on earth would HM change their interpretation of the upper panel lines on the F-35B after producing several thousand F-35As?
So there you have it. If anyone thinks that continually criticizing the model on the forums will have any effect - you are not being realistic.
The lesson here is that forum readers account for maybe 5% of sales. We can argue for accuracy (and we can get results if done so in a professional manner) - but ultimately it is a business in the end.
First Photos Hobby Master's F-35B Tooling
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