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Old 11-20-2016, 01:41 PM   #1 (permalink)
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THANK YOU for shutting down the thread about "half the Trump voters..." I resisted the temptation to get involved (and I'm glad I did) because it would do no good. That thread was a microcosm of the terrible polarization in the U.S. I'm 63 and can't recall it ever being this bad. "Liberal" vs. "Conservative" - hogwash. We're all Americans over here and it's time to learn what compromise and working together means - IMO. The vitriolic atmosphere is cancerous and keeps spreading.

I have "liberal" and "conservative" friends, but I don't label them. They're my friends first. Their political views are secondary since none of us force our views on each other. We can respectfully debate and in the end agree we all share a common goal.
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Old 11-20-2016, 02:23 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Here here.... thanks for taking it down.
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Old 11-20-2016, 06:45 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Although I did participate, I am glad it was taken down too.

I would like to say one thing, and this has been mentioned before by other members so I know I am not alone in this view.

Without mentioning names, I have noticed that while 99% of members are friendly and interested is sharing our passion of models, however there is a small cadre of trolls here that seemingly enjoy making other people enjoyment of the forum as miserable as they can.

I am not talking about a disagreement that gets out of hand (that can happen anywhere), but a very small group of people whom are deliberately nasty to other members, and whom are clearly enjoying it even going as far as to congratulate each other or bragging about it. Its ALWAYS the same group of people.

I have a suspicion that some of these people are not even interested in models, but are here simply because they enjoy raising mayhem (and are allowed to get away with it).

aae991 is correct that the poisonous political atmosphere makes it much worse, but this bad element has always existed here and its not uniquely because of politics. I've seen it on the models part of the forums as well.

This thread wasn't the first time things got ugly here, (wont be the last either, unless changes are made), but its getting tiring to see. In the last thread, my frustration was not just that these people where here trying to ruin a discussion, but that nothing was being done to resume control which was exactly what these trolls had counted on. I am certainly not going to tell Lou how to run his site, but I will say that other sites have much stricter rules that enforce forum etiquette so that it is a more enjoyable experience for all. Just something to consider.

That's my 2 cents.

Last edited by mmarsh; 11-20-2016 at 08:20 PM.
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:25 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Dude, the only troll around here is you! I have been reading your post for years and you cannot keep your big mouth shut! You always have to have the last word! You where trashed big time in the other thread but you cannot let it go! Give it up and let it go! thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmarsh View Post
Although I did participate, I am glad it was taken down too.

I would like to say one thing, and this has been mentioned before by other members so I know I am not alone in this view.

Without mentioning names, I have noticed that while 99% of members are friendly and interested is sharing our passion of models, however there is a small cadre of trolls here that seemingly enjoy making other people enjoyment of the forum as miserable as they can.

I am not talking about a disagreement that gets out of hand (that can happen anywhere), but a very small group of people whom are deliberately nasty to other members, and whom are clearly enjoying it even going as far as to congratulate each other or bragging about it. Its ALWAYS the same group of people.

I have a suspicion that some of these people are not even interested in models, but are here simply because they enjoy raising mayhem (and are allowed to get away with it).

aae991 is correct that the poisonous political atmosphere makes it much worse, but this bad element has always existed here and its not uniquely because of politics. I've seen it on the models part of the forums as well.

This thread wasn't the first time things got ugly here, (wont be the last either, unless changes are made), but its getting tiring to see. In the last thread, my frustration was not just that these people where here trying to ruin a discussion, but that nothing was being done to resume control which was exactly what these trolls had counted on. I am certainly not going to tell Lou how to run his site, but I will say that other sites have much stricter rules that enforce forum etiquette so that it is a more enjoyable experience for all. Just something to consider.

That's my 2 cents.
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mmarsh View Post
Although I did participate, . I am certainly not going to tell Lou how to run his site, but I will say that other sites have much stricter rules that enforce forum etiquette so that it is a more enjoyable experience for all. Just something to consider.

That's my 2 cents.
Yep, I had also participated early on in that thread; but when I saw the mud-slinging starting to creep up I decided to move on.

By the way, I was unaware that Lou had purchased the DAC forum? If so, my congrats to him.

Cheers! T7
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:48 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Dude, the only troll around here is you! I have been reading your post for years and you cannot keep your big mouth shut! You always have to have the last word! You where trashed big time in the other thread but you cannot let it go! Give it up and let it go! thread

You just proved EXACTLY what I am talking about. People who do not respect other peoples right to their opinion and feel they "deserve" to be mistreated if that opinion doesn't match their's. That is precisely the problem. You feel I got what I deserved because I wouldn't back down from my opinion. You wanted for me to keep and quiet and I wouldn't so ergo it was OK to trash talk me. This exactly why we need stronger moderation.

Stating an opinion is NOT trolling, you might not like it, you might think its the most asinine thing you ever heard, but its still not trolling. There is a very simple rule: Attack the post, not the poster. Unfortunately people like you and several others cannot tell the difference; if someone says something you disagree with you view it as justifiable to make personal attacks. On most forums, that would get you a ban.

I have only been here less than 2 years and don't post too often, so I don't think you know me at all. For the record I don't start fights, never have. If I get provoked I will clamp down like a pitbull that I do not deny. I don't like being disrespected especially when its uncalled for, if you do: the gloves come off. You are welcome to disagree but don't be rude about it and we'll be fine. I always prefer a good debate to a fight, but I wont back down from a fight either.

As I said this not the first time, there have been other instances where I have not been involved at all just been a witness, but like I said, its always the same cadre of people involved.

Last edited by mmarsh; 11-20-2016 at 10:06 PM.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:06 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by T7_4ever View Post
Yep, I had also participated early on in that thread; but when I saw the mud-slinging starting to creep up I decided to move on.

By the way, I was unaware that Lou had purchased the DAC forum? If so, my congrats to him.

Cheers! T7
Its my mistake, I actually thought Lou was the owner. Sorry if this confused you.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:35 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Bottomline this is a diecast forum. People that don't actively participate in the diecast sections but instead persistently come up with political or other drivel in the general squawk section should be thrown off the forum permanently. If all people want to do is talk crap but have no interest in diecast, there is a plethora of other social media and / or forums available.
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Old 11-20-2016, 10:02 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by r3500vdp View Post
Bottomline this is a diecast forum. People that don't actively participate in the diecast sections but instead persistently come up with political or other drivel in the general squawk section should be thrown off the forum permanently. If all people want to do is talk crap but have no interest in diecast, there is a plethora of other social media and / or forums available.
Agreed, but its not just regulated to the Squawk. I see people going off at each other (military diecast forums) for no reason at all as well. I simple do not understand why people have to be so snide to one another because they disagree. Its a model airplane after all, its not life or death.

Personally I think the answer is more liberal use of the ban hammer. It keeps people in line -allowed to disagree, but in a respectful manner.

Verbal warning/3 day temp ban/permaban if there multiple infractions of the temp ban.

Last edited by mmarsh; 11-20-2016 at 10:09 PM.
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Old 11-20-2016, 10:25 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmarsh View Post
Agreed, but its not just regulated to the Squawk. I see people going off at each other (military diecast forums) for no reason at all as well. I simple do not understand why people have to be so snide to one another because they disagree. Its a model airplane after all, its not life or death.

Personally I think the answer is more liberal use of the ban hammer. It keeps people in line -allowed to disagree, but in a respectful manner.

Verbal warning/3 day temp ban/permaban if there multiple infractions of the temp ban.
Not to add to this scintillating topic...but I have to ask, why do you edit almost every one of your posts? Just curious.
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Old 11-20-2016, 10:36 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: To Lou

I am guilty of contributing to the thread. I'm sorry,but I found the Moose patrolling the Canadian border funny. I also contribute far more to diecast topics than non.
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Old 11-20-2016, 10:42 PM   #12 (permalink)
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And as we all know political arguments should be made on facebook. That's how you win and convince people you are right. Just trying to keep it light folks. I agree though this forum should be all about aviation.
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Old 11-21-2016, 12:17 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: To Lou

Please ban all politically themed threads.

What the vocal minority forgets is that this site is not meant just for North Americans and Australian collectors (mostly), but a worldwide audience of collectors.

If threads are allowed which disparages those of other faiths, political views, races, sexual orientation, then it will cause 'wars' on DA.C as those views should not be allowed to thrive.

Yes, a heavy discussion thread in the GST do get a lot of views, but does it contribute towards the hobby or towards advertising revenue?

As MMarch points out, it is a toxic part of this forum and that toxicity spills over to other sections of the forum as well. In fact, I will probably never post a photo of any of my collection, as I feel like I will then be sure to get to hear how awful some other part of my models are and all the inaccuracies.

I also have a list of people who are most likely to start and participate in those types of threads and am also of the view that they do it only because it is fun for them to rile people up.

Just look at this thread. MMarch was making a valid arguments with his reasoning behind them and the immediately called a troll and is said to have been "trashed big time". Really? Is that necessary?

I see a lot of regular collectors have already left this site or are just lurking as getting involved is just not worth it anymore.

I don't think it is Lou who can made the call though, the mighty dollar will win (the site is free to us because it is sponsored by advertising) , so 'number of views, combined with the 'advertising revenue' will probably be the winner here.

But the owners should keep in mind that if people are chased away by a certain vocal political group, then at the end of the day this site will only be populated by those few.

Sadly, I guess we will most probably have to live with those threads or leave the site.
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Old 11-21-2016, 05:33 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gospodin View Post
Not to add to this scintillating topic...but I have to ask, why do you edit almost every one of your posts? Just curious.
Its because of my terrible typing skills, if I didn't you'd think I'm speaking Navajo.
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Old 11-21-2016, 10:37 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Who cares? Remember... once you turn off your computer everyone on the internet is out of your life and you have the option when you turn it back on not to let them back in.
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cyber bullied? Turn off your computer!
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Old 11-21-2016, 10:55 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Who cares? Remember... once you turn off your computer everyone on the internet is out of your life and you have the option when you turn it back on not to let them back in.
Dave

cyber bullied? Turn off your computer!
So basically you are letting the bullies control your life? How could you possibly live like that? Its not good for the site either, if a small group of bullies chases away all the people who come here to talk model airplanes, the site becomes a ghost town.
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Old 11-21-2016, 11:45 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: To Lou

everybody on the internet is usually anonymous to some extent, so cyber bullying becomes sadly a way of life if you're behind the computer, social network sites etc. but if you feel your have been the victim of this horrible trend than you can always report it at www.stopbullying.gov
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Old 11-21-2016, 12:01 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I think I will need an emotional support animal when on DAC due to the stress and trauma and we all know my feelings about those!
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Old 11-21-2016, 12:13 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I have tried to get admin. to remove all political threads on this site, but they refused. Glad to see they have finally done something.

If a member wants to discuss politics, there are plenty of political forums they can join. IMO, this is not the place for it.
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Old 11-21-2016, 12:17 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by car15 View Post
Dude, the only troll around here is you! I have been reading your post for years and you cannot keep your big mouth shut! You always have to have the last word! You where trashed big time in the other thread but you cannot let it go! Give it up and let it go! thread
Without mentioning names, a particular user has several posts here so I'm hopeful that he will learn something from this thread.


Quote:
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Who cares? Remember... once you turn off your computer everyone on the internet is out of your life and you have the option when you turn it back on not to let them back in.
Dave

cyber bullied? Turn off your computer!
This reminds me of Tyler the Creator's famous tweet:

http://i.imgur.com/JH65NB3.png

Don't forget there's also an ignore feature on this forum.

Participating in a heated political thread is also as much a personal decision as not participating.
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Old 11-21-2016, 12:48 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Aardvark View Post
Without mentioning names, a particular user has several posts here so I'm hopeful that he will learn something from this thread.
Just in case some of you (MODS) needed some additional proof of what I was talking about, this is a prime example. Notice its not even political debate and hes already trying stir trouble and turn it personal.
Its simply someone trying to to provoke someone else for kicks, and its people like this that are ruining the site for everyone. He's sadly not alone in doing it.

Like I said before, we really do need more usage of the ban-hammer.

Last edited by mmarsh; 11-21-2016 at 01:05 PM.
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Old 11-21-2016, 01:20 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Just in case some of you (MODS) needed some additional proof of what I was talking about, this is a prime example. Notice its not even political debate and hes already trying stir trouble and turn it personal.
Its simply someone trying to to provoke someone else for kicks, and its people like this that are ruining the site for everyone. He's sadly not alone in doing it.

Like I said before, we really do need more usage of the ban-hammer.
Get off your high horse and give it a break, Marsh.
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Old 11-21-2016, 01:39 PM   #23 (permalink)
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"The Wild West of Airplane Collecting!"

Some don't remember DAC back in the day

Sounds like some above need their 'Safe Space'
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Old 11-21-2016, 02:16 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Sounds like some above need their 'Safe Space'
Perhaps we should take up a collection for Play Dough and Coloring books for those 'in need'..??
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Old 11-21-2016, 03:21 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Here's another example back in June.

Can't remember which member was involved but it was back when all the Russian Hooligans were out in force screwing up the FIFA World Cup, so already there were tensions with that country. (If the person whom involved see this, feel free to correct me if certain facts are wrong).

At the same time, there was a good conversation going on the military forums about modern jets that I was shadowing and somebody made the innocent comment of "I am not a fan of Russian jets models" in context to the conversation. Mind you not the country, not the people, only his personal preference of which models he enjoyed collecting. That's all.

And within a few hours, 1/2 trolls (new accounts) whom were obviously Russian ultra-nationalists just went off on this guy for a good long while, insulting him, insulting the west, bragged about how everything is better in Russia, etc. Your typical Kremlin Trolls you see on other political forums, suddenly appeared here.

And all because he stated that Russia Airplanes Models (not the real thing) were not his cup of tea...I mean seriously.

Now normally that would be an immediate kick offense, as it was obvious these people had no interest in die-cast and were only here to cause mayhem and yet in inexplicably nothing was done. I am not sure why. Maybe it was a timezone issue, Maybe wasn't caught in time, or simply a lack of interest. But it was obviously that these people were providing no value to the community and were here only to cause misery why they were not immediately ejected I do not know.

Last edited by mmarsh; 11-21-2016 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 11-21-2016, 03:59 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: To Lou

So the attitude of the majority, in this thread at least, so maybe it is indicative of the general population of DA.C as well is:

1) "Turn off your computer"
2) Report "bullying" to a governmental organization (as if the DA.C admins and moderators can't step in)
3) A suggestion of emotional support animals.
4) Use the ignore feature.
5) Don't participate even if what is being said goes against the greater good of humanity.
The funny thing about this one is the users on here who says that people should stand up against oppression. But that probably only counts if you are a refugee eh?
6) A suggestion of safe spaces. The "wild west" is such a 19th century, why would you think it was a swell time to live?
7) Giving Play Dough and Coloring books for those 'in need'

Geez people. Is it too difficult to share a hobby forum with fellow collectors?
I don't know difficult it is to grow up in your countries, , but my view is that civilized people shoudl airing disagreements in an adult manner without going in all guns blazing

Do you treat guests to your homes the same? We are all guests here.
We share a common interest.

I can only guess about the reasoning behind the keyboard warriors on here.
It is a shame.

If it is not clear to the moderator(s) on the state of things on DA.C then it is probably time to let it go.

Yes, I do choose the type of persons I hang out with and consider my "friends".
There are plenty on here which I would not invite near my home.
So I will have to rethink the value of DA.C. Many others made the difficult decision.
Fortunately there are other options available in our modern world.

This is a microcosm of why the world is in such a state.
Most think 'winning'is all that counts. There is no room for compromise for the sake of humanity.
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Old 11-21-2016, 04:02 PM   #27 (permalink)
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So much for this thread putting an end to the bickering on the General Squawk section. Sure, we can all just not visit this part of the website, but there are so many other more effective places to rant about politics and personalities vs. D.A.C.

Oh well, it was worth a shot... Carry on and enjoy your fun
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Old 11-21-2016, 04:26 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eugenevh View Post
So the attitude of the majority, in this thread at least, so maybe it is indicative of the general population of DA.C as well is:

1) "Turn off your computer"
2) Report "bullying" to a governmental organization (as if the DA.C admins and moderators can't step in)
3) A suggestion of emotional support animals.
4) Use the ignore feature.
5) Don't participate even if what is being said goes against the greater good of humanity.
The funny thing about this one is the users on here who says that people should stand up against oppression. But that probably only counts if you are a refugee eh?
6) A suggestion of safe spaces. The "wild west" is such a 19th century, why would you think it was a swell time to live?
7) Giving Play Dough and Coloring books for those 'in need'

Geez people. Is it too difficult to share a hobby forum with fellow collectors?
I don't know difficult it is to grow up in your countries, , but my view is that civilized people shoudl airing disagreements in an adult manner without going in all guns blazing

Do you treat guests to your homes the same? We are all guests here.
We share a common interest.

I can only guess about the reasoning behind the keyboard warriors on here.
It is a shame.

If it is not clear to the moderator(s) on the state of things on DA.C then it is probably time to let it go.

Yes, I do choose the type of persons I hang out with and consider my "friends".
There are plenty on here which I would not invite near my home.
So I will have to rethink the value of DA.C. Many others made the difficult decision.
Fortunately there are other options available in our modern world.

This is a microcosm of why the world is in such a state.
Most think 'winning'is all that counts. There is no room for compromise for the sake of humanity.
Lighten up Francis...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OnpkDWbeJs
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Old 11-22-2016, 12:23 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Chics dig me because I rarely wear underwear.

And no Trump didn't say that for those who don't get the reference.
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Old 11-22-2016, 12:26 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mmarsh View Post
Its my mistake, I actually thought Lou was the owner. Sorry if this confused you.
That's cool. I thought Lou was pulling double duty for a second; being the forum owner and moderator at the same time. Thank you for responding to my question. Cheers! T7
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