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Old 01-19-2016, 08:31 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default analyzing the retro LH 748

https://www.aviation-center-berlin.de/p/GJDLH1479

imho:
  • tail off-shape
  • outboard pylons a differ from the inboard ones
  • cockpit printed too low
  • grey on the fuselages underside is still way too light
comments welcome
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Old 01-20-2016, 09:32 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

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Originally Posted by European Collector View Post

imho:
  • tail off-shape
  • outboard pylons a differ from the inboard ones
  • cockpit printed too low
  • grey on the fuselages underside is still way too light
comments welcome
1.) Tail shape looks about right to me. Not seeing where it is off

2.) In what way are the pylons wrong? by design, the inboard pylons are a completely different design from the outboards, so I am not too sure what your complaint is about this

3.) Cockpit might be slightly low, but only by a miniscule bit. It looks pretty close to me.

4.) The grey on the underside is correct. Even when compared to the photos you linked to, it looks correct. when compared to a photo I took of the aircraft on its first flight, (Hull Photography Services | Boeing 747 | Lufthansa D-ABYT) it looks correct!

My source: I worked at Boeing as a Preflight and Delivery mechanic on the 747-8 delivery flight line, and I worked on most of the 747-8s that are flying, including this one.
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Old 01-20-2016, 09:49 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

correct me if i am wrong the only part where the pylons differ is the rear part. they are the same on the part where the engines are mounted, right? and the curve on the tail is way too big (starts way too high). and the positioning of the cockpit makes its front windows appear in the wrong angle.
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Old 01-20-2016, 10:10 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

The pylons are correct. They are not the same. The engine mounting hardware and locations are approx. the same on all four, but the inboards and outboards are completely different designs. And after looking a little closer at the tail, I do see what you are talking about now. I am trying to decide if it's an artifact from a low quality photo or not.
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Old 01-20-2016, 10:32 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

but you have to admit that these parts of the pylons look pretty the same, and this is the part what (at least on that model) GJ did not get right.
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Old 01-20-2016, 01:50 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

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Originally Posted by krislhull View Post
My source: I worked at Boeing as a Preflight and Delivery mechanic on the 747-8 delivery flight line, and I worked on most of the 747-8s that are flying, including this one.
A question that has been bothering me since the delivery of D-ABYT is 'Why was the belly not polished like in the 1980s?' Are there technical reasons or is it more expensive? Can the 747-8 be operated with a polished finish? I mean it did work with the 747-400 and Northwest.
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Old 01-20-2016, 03:42 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

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A question that has been bothering me since the delivery of D-ABYT is 'Why was the belly not polished like in the 1980s?' Are there technical reasons or is it more expensive? Can the 747-8 be operated with a polished finish? I mean it did work with the 747-400 and Northwest.
I actually have no idea why they didn't leave the belly in bare polished metal. I have wondered that many times myself! I do agree, it would have looked better. I guess that is a question for Lufthansa, since they are the ones that dictated the livery.
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Old 01-20-2016, 03:46 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Thanks for your reply. So bare polished metal would be possible on the 747-8? I once heard that the aluminium now in use would require some kind of paint finish.
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Old 01-20-2016, 03:59 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

I haven't heard that one. Just a couple of years ago, we were still delivering bare metal aircraft to AA, so I don't think it had anything to do with a different alloy of aluminum. My best guess would be that LH saw it reduced maintenance costs, no matter how slight they might be, or didn't think it would look correct with the composite fairing panels on the wing to body join area.
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Old 01-20-2016, 04:16 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Thanks a lot you shed some light on this. So I guess LH didn't want a one off with a completely different kind of finish for maintenance reasons.
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Old 01-20-2016, 04:19 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

maybe a matter of personal taste - to not make the color difference THAT obvious....
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Old 01-20-2016, 06:01 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

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Thanks a lot you shed some light on this. So I guess LH didn't want a one off with a completely different kind of finish for maintenance reasons.
That is just my best guess, so take it for what it is!
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Old 01-20-2016, 06:27 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Even a silver/metal paint effect would have looked better than the flat looking grey tone which kind of kills the whole retro feel for me. It's almost like when BA repainted a Landor 747 into a half arsed attempt at a BOAC livery for it's last hurrah.
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Old 01-21-2016, 01:55 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

I would assume a paint finish would be there to protect the skin from corrosion, dirt and damage.

Keeping Al alloys polished would also be more maintenance intensive & costly. Unless of course you polish them and then apply some sort of nifty high hardness clear coat over the top. Of course CFRP and other materials will tend to stand out with this sort of treatment on more modern types. Which may detract from the looks somewhat.
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Old 01-21-2016, 07:37 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

My Gemini 747-8 LH retro is on its way to Bishkek and will probably land next Wednesday at Manas International Airport (in the belly of a Turkish Airlines 737-800). It will be my third LH747-8 (standard and Siegerflieger).

I heard that on the new composite carbon parts of modern aircraft it is not possible to apply a polished look, see e. g. the former American Airlines A300, or Lufthansa's other famos retro airliner, the A321 D-AIRX.

Greetings to Ciderman from his forum mate of 1zu160 (Speebird).
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Old 01-21-2016, 08:43 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

I am happy with mine and don't have the pylon/engine mount issues as shown in Aviation Center Berlins pics (fuzzy shots anyway, worse than Waffles recent shots), it looks like that particular model possibly didn't have the engines snapped into or glued to the pylons correctly?`yes... tail curve is a tad high.

the only issue i had was to correct the inner main gear doors sitting atop the inner tires causing the model to rock and sit uneven. a $2.00 pair of mini needlenose pliers from Harbor Freight fixed her up!

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Old 01-21-2016, 09:15 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

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I heard that on the new composite carbon parts of modern aircraft it is not possible to apply a polished look, see e. g. the former American Airlines A300, or Lufthansa's other famos retro airliner, the A321 D-AIRX.
The wing to body fairings on the 747 have always been composite, so they have always been painted, as seen in this photo of a LH 747-200:

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Old 01-22-2016, 05:05 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

The 'Almost Retro' LH 748 - yeah, the gray belly is a bummer. I thought the delivery scheme livery on the original LH 747s was great, and somewhere along the way, I had the notion that the shiny polished aluminum bellies were lacquered the hold the shine - they always looked good. Anyway, the LH 748 retro effect seems half-hearted - like a tired old 747 museum piece. I gave my Phoenix example away to a friend who works for Lufthansa Technik in Hamburg, and he likes it. The Lufthansa people all seem to really love their 748s. Later, Doug
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Old 01-22-2016, 02:01 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

I have not received my RETRO yet, but when I look at the 2 previous GJ LH 8i releases, I notice that the pylons actually are the same at the forward mounting point, but depending on how the nacelles are installed they have a little play in them and can be placed slightly lower on the engine core strut so in effect making it look like a completely different pylon in a mount to mount comparison. I know that the GJ vertical stab & rudder insert into a tab slot opening and possibly this model was not inserted/seated properly? Really hard to tell from the foto if that might have anything to do with the appearance of the curvature being shifted???
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Old 01-22-2016, 04:07 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Damn it. Every time I see "748" I think of the Hawker Siddeley HS748. I'm always disappointed when I open a thread and realize it's only about a 747-800.
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Old 01-24-2016, 06:22 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Zendocon,
Every time I come across the other monicker 748i, I think BMW has invented something new !
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Old 01-27-2016, 06:30 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: analyzing the retro LH 748

Borrowing from a neighbouring thread,
the nose cone on my LH 748i does NOT have a stylized Lufthansa logo...I'm sure Adrian and Mathieu can relate.

Please, GJ, pay a tad more attention to QC / packing.
Also, B747-100/-200 wing aerials could use some TLC as well.

And, as long as we are in Lufthansa retro-mode, GEMINI LH B747-100 w/PW eng. --delivery scheme , and
LH B747-200 delivery AND 90's white w/the Gemini GE engines which I very much prefer ought make their appearance soon !!!!!!!!!!!
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