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Old 01-13-2021, 09:44 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I am going to go on a rant like my friend Jerry from BigJet TV does...

Over the years it has been quite obvious that a few collectors here are very critical and vocal about the smallest inaccuracies produced by ALL manufacturers.. I think it must be an ego thing to prove to the world that they are wannabe aerospace engineers. I personally have been collecting model airplanes (embarrassed to say for nearly 50 years) during that time frame I’ve seen the quality and details go from toylike to near perfection. I have also probably amassed, collected and sold nearly 10,000 models in that time frame...I can honestly say that maybe three or four models didn’t meet my criteria and got rid of due to inaccuracy. To me, if someone is that critical of a mistake, that is so minute and barely noticeable they don’t need to be in this hobby. I find it frustrating when members like Gold Leader and Aussiejets posts pictures of their latest models on this forum, 95% of the feedback is positive and then there is that one or two heros that want to point out an error and take the fun out of it all. I understand the frustration of “I work hard for my money and these models must be perfect” .. but even the most expensive 1:1 automobiles have issues too..

My suggestion is if you are so picky and that cockpit is off by 1/1000th of a millimetre, the cheat line is off by a hair then your in the wrong hobby..There is a reason why most manufacturers who eagerly used to participate in forums like this have left as the hard core critical collectors have scared them off. Yes I know about that other company on the 400 scale section that everybody praises idolises and puts on a pedestal and yes I agree they have done a good job in listening to the collector and following through, but now the complaints are slowly starting to come in against them too, maybe it’s only a matter of time before they follow suit as well..

I think fellow DACer robertjon5 summed it up best:
I BUY WHAT I LIKE and I LIKE WHAT I BUY!

Rant over.. what are your thoughts, agree with me or tell me to stick it where the sun doesn’t shine!
BTW, this rant does not support models that come damaged due to poor glue or shipping damage.. for that I agree with those 100%
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:48 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I remember the days when I first started collecting 1:200 when we were thrilled just to get ANYTHING produced in this scale. When we'd BEG the airlines to send us corporate models because they wouldn't make them available on the retail level. (Virgin and Qatar come to mind!) Now there are collectors who complain about the position of pax windows, the size and/or shape of the cockpit windows, the shape of the engines and their position in relation to the ground (that one kills me) and the stance. That said, I don't care much for the IF200 747 mould, but if they were to release a model I had to have, then I'd certainly buy it.

One thing I noticed recently is that DAC members don't care about plastic models. I recently posted photos of my 2 latest acquisitions. Both models of actual aircraft I've flown on so they were special to me. I spent 40 minutes taking photos, posting to Flickr then copying and pasting and creating a post on here to share my joy. You were the only one to comment, Russell. robertjon5 received the same lack of response recently when he posted photos of his 2 Skymarks BA 744s. What happened to the camaraderie on here? The models may not be everyone's cup of tea, but be happy for the person who acquired them. It's very disheartening and I came close to completely deleting my profile on here.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:58 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

First: I appreciate you being part of this forum as a spokesman of a manufacturer and I see where you're coming from.

I totally agree. "Buy what you like" is my philosophy aswell. I never buy models which I do not like. I got some GJ200s (maybe not as much as others) and I am very happy with them, but constructive criticism (as miniscule as the issue sometimes might be) has to be allowed.

As you mentioned 1:1 cars:
when I'd buy a Mercedes and I get one delivered with a missiing star I want that issue being solved my the guys in charge, right? I don't say "Oh the rest of the car looks great, nevermind" - you don't do that.

To sum it up, I am very pleased with all the models I got so far, and I am pretty sure there are coming a lot more in the future.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:03 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Agree. Bl00dy rivetcounters.
I along with others spend a lot of our time, setting up, and taking photos of a latest acquistion to met by critiscm.
Currently photoing all my 1/200 = maybe 200+ models.
that is taking a lot of weekends, when I could be doing other things in this limited lifespan.
I hardly post anymore as it just isn't worth it.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:36 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Definitely agree here crownvic. I do think some manufacturers do get a lot of criticism, some deserved, some out of order. I do think the negatives of some models get highlighted a lot more than positives and if a manufacturer only receives negative feedback with no praise, they simply Disengage with their audience as there’s no point engaging with them.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:39 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Gotta agree here, like there’s models I’ve seen that manufacturers have just slaughtered but those are few and far between, most stuff is just nit picky. The only reason I’d really care about the flaws is whenever multiple retailers do a model at the same time, but other than that, I could really care less. Like just let people enjoy their models.
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Old 01-13-2021, 11:40 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Russell, video number 2 is actually in production....

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Old 01-13-2021, 11:49 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jet-X View Post
Russell, video number 2 is actually in production....

Only the diehards know about video number 1 lol 😂
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:48 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

During 2020 I’ve posted over 20 threads of my various custom models and I have to say nobody has made a negative comment about any of them. I had expected nitpickers to come up with some with some criticism of one type or another, but no, it seems I’m the only one who can spot my errors. So thank you to the 20 members who have responded kindly to my to all my custom threads.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:19 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

My buddy since the 60s and I collected anything airlines we could get our hands on. The hobby truly has gone from toylike to outstanding realism. Every silver lining has its cloud and if you look for them you can find imperfections on anything. Heck have you ever caught yourself looking at a 1:1 and you say to yourself if I had the model exactly like it, I'd swear something was off?

I say if the model captures the essence of the airplane, then enjoy it.
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Old 01-13-2021, 02:05 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I agree completely Russell. It is one of the primary reasons I stopped posting about 10 years ago. Another reason is that the forum was much more entertaining in the old days.
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Old 01-13-2021, 02:09 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

When I say that Inflight should use some money to rework the wings of its "B 707-300", is it nitpicking ?
I could add the Comet to the list ...

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Old 01-13-2021, 02:21 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I totally agree Russell. I notice it more on 1/400 though and it's always the same whingers.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

There will always be those types of people in any hobby, but they have their place just like everyone else. Constructive criticism can be a force for good and produce more accurate models and schemes. At the end of the day this type of criticism is never going to go away because a) people pay a shedload of money for these models now, so are naturally demanding b) like to get into a p***ing contest about how observant they are and c) have an agenda of their own that only their mind can fathom. It's all part and parcelling of a collecting hobby, it's no different collecting military, civvies, tanks, ships, cars, trucks (man you should see some of the Oxford diecast collectors!). Thick skin or water off a ducks back, it's the only way to go.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:59 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

My only beef with GJ is that the 1/200 C-130's vertical stabilizers are made of plastic. Please consider metal. Aside from that, GJ is the benchmark of 1/200 models in my opinion.
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:23 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

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Originally Posted by modelmanGB View Post
During 2020 I’ve posted over 20 threads of my various custom models and I have to say nobody has made a negative comment about any of them. I had expected nitpickers to come up with some with some criticism of one type or another, but no, it seems I’m the only one who can spot my errors. So thank you to the 20 members who have responded kindly to my to all my custom threads.
After all the personal blood, sweat, tears, and love which go into a custom built model, you should read nothing but praise for your efforts!! I used to build Airfix kits, and was happy with my results, even if it wasn't up to someone else's standards. Keep going, and enjoy!!

Nice post Crownvic, and I agree 1000%!!
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Old 01-13-2021, 06:15 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I think there is a line between nitpicking and accurate.

A good example...Pan Am. The billboard paint scheme stayed constant in it lifetime as far as I know, however there is a dramatic difference in the color between Aeroclassics and Gemini. So much so, they stand out as different on a shelf next to each other. That is something a layman would notice. Is that nitpicking? I don’t think so.

Also, certain manufacturers are so unable to take negative criticism it ruins the constructive criticism thing. And honestly impacts buying habits. If your response to anything is “but you don’t know anything” , might as well just wait for waffle to post in the periodic “has anyone ever been verbally assaulted by a model airplane dealer thread.”
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Old 01-13-2021, 08:27 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

6-7 years ago, when my daughter and I began collecting, I did not care if there were any issues and they did not bother me. What bothered me then and now is the certain somebodies who complained about every post I made. So, we decided to tune it down, and now we only got one model all of last year.

I still like my models as does my daughter, but we got sick of all the infantile keyboard warriors flacking us, so we took a huge step back so to speak and sold off a large majority of our diecast collection. Still have some which are never going to leave and plenty of plastics too.
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Old 01-13-2021, 09:13 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Its important to note the forum rules too:

"Photo threads are not to be used for model bashing. Another thread can be opened to show the shortfalls of the model and have healthy discussions on them. Photos need to be used with owner consent only. Threads/post will be removed if owner’s permissions have not been taken"
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Real tomato ketchup Eddie?
Nothing but the best! "I don't know why they call this stuff hamburger helper. It does just fine by itself, huh? I like it better than tuna helper myself, don't you, Clark?"
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Old 01-14-2021, 03:03 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

As a sidenote, the phrase “I buy what I like and I like what I buy” provides much room for interpretation; therefore, it’s far from giving a helpful ‘direction’ in any discussion about “What’s normal”, “What’s exaggerated”, and “What’s simply excusing” concerning the actual and/or potential quality (or details featured) on aircraft scale models.

What I have seen in my 40 years of collecting is a mixture of manufacturrers’ (technical) capabilities, collectors’ requirements/demands, and manufacturers’ dedication to their products and their customers’ needs. The latter has been and still is referring to what can be achieved under the given technical and economical conditions on the one hand, and what is actually delivered on the other hand.

An easy-to-understand example: those of you who are old enough for being somehow familiar with Schabak 1/600 models will remember the limited technical premises for producing very small-scaled die-cast metal models back in the Seventies and Eighties. The final model mould was just one piece and painted after parts (normally two, i.e. upper and lower fuselage moulds with wings and stabs belonging to one or the other) had been pressed together, so only one colour could be painted on the model (normally silver or white as basic colour) and all necessary details such as windshield, cabin doors/windows, and of course the airline livery were applied by using decals. Nobody would’ve ever requested antennae, small details of airframe structure decaled to engines or wings or anything like that, of course.
In essence: the one and only focus of early Schabak collectors was if the decals were applied straight on the fuselage and tail, i.e. no curved cheatlines (and windows), no mirrored stickers (which was possible since Schabak used water-based slide-stickers (I don’t know the technical term for those, sorry)). One might think that applying decals straight was a simple or a natural sign of quality back then... no, not in the slightest!

Why do I chose this example: there's only one quality criteria for the collector - straight-applied cheatline/cabin window decals. Schabak mainly made its money by selling large quantities to airlines and other companies as promotional give-away items, that's why the price was reasonable back in the day. But companies were not as 'nitpicking' as a collector would have been, so having models with misplaced or curved or mirrored decals were a common problem (or pain in the neck) for anyone who started collecting Schabaks. The fact that the big money came from corporate contracts made Schabak ignorant towards collectors' input - huge quantities were sold to airlines for the big money, remainders were sold through airport gift shops and the very, very few specialised retailers which carried Schabaks in addition to their regular scale model business (either model railway dealers or general toy shops back then).

Time shift into 1/200: Upscaled models - upscaled demands. This is a very natural development and I must say that I consider a pretty big part of the collectors' ciriticism posted here and on other forums as reasonable, particularly when we are talkign about the 1/200 scale. Mostly, the crucial point (for me) is whether the manufacturer made a bad design in general or if a certain model was actively screwed up although - with conscientious and thoroughly use of the available devices for this particular model release - would have allowed a better product. When it's about bad design (either the aircraft's mould itself or the paint job), I can address that problem but am also able to avoid buying that specific models. But when an individual model or a batch of a production run is actually screwed up (inferior paint quality, misplaced or wrongly scaled printing (especially windshield), wrong colours or logos applied, parts bent or broken off etc.), then it's literaly necessary to address these problem and to demand a product in what we all now as "mint quality", i.e. the quality the manufacturer must reasonably achieve but was not accomplished in that certain case. In that case, just saying "Buy what you like" (and "Don't buy what you don't like") would not meet the true standard we are all heading to - or looking for.

All in all, in that respect EuropeanCollector's comparison of our scale model hobby to buying a new car is quite striking: "Build me a new S Class - I can live with a some scratches and bumps, no problem. And you can keep the Mercedes star too, if you want". Really? No, of course not.

Above, Grizz said: "Constructive criticism can be a force for good and produce more accurate models". I agree totally. A reasonable and objective manner should be the maxim in general when we are talking about criticism - be it criticism of scale models or whatsoever. In this respect, I wouldn't even use "nitpickers", "whiners" or "complainers" as headline for a discussion thread like this.
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Old 01-14-2021, 03:11 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Real tomato ketchup, Russ?
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Old 01-14-2021, 07:15 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I think there is a line between nitpicking and accurate.

A good example...Pan Am. The billboard paint scheme stayed constant in it lifetime as far as I know, however there is a dramatic difference in the color between Aeroclassics and Gemini. So much so, they stand out as different on a shelf next to each other. That is something a layman would notice. Is that nitpicking? I don’t think so.

Also, certain manufacturers are so unable to take negative criticism it ruins the constructive criticism thing. And honestly impacts buying habits. If your response to anything is “but you don’t know anything” , might as well just wait for waffle to post in the periodic “has anyone ever been verbally assaulted by a model airplane dealer thread.”

Yes the original paint would be the same, but fades quickly, so at an airport you would see Pan Am billboards in different shades of blue - or any airline for that matter. So your display is more realistic of the real world....?
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Old 01-14-2021, 08:21 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Real tomato ketchup Eddie?
Nothing but the best! "I don't know why they call this stuff hamburger helper. It does just fine by itself, huh? I like it better than tuna helper myself, don't you, Clark?"
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Old 01-14-2021, 08:47 AM   #24 (permalink)
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...

One thing I noticed recently is that DAC members don't care about plastic models. I recently posted photos of my 2 latest acquisitions. Both models of actual aircraft I've flown on so they were special to me. I spent 40 minutes taking photos, posting to Flickr then copying and pasting and creating a post on here to share my joy. You were the only one to comment, Russell. robertjon5 received the same lack of response recently when he posted photos of his 2 Skymarks BA 744s. What happened to the camaraderie on here? The models may not be everyone's cup of tea, but be happy for the person who acquired them. It's very disheartening and I came close to completely deleting my profile on here.
To speak for myself: due to the fact that this is an english speaking forum and sometimes I have to think twice if it makes sense what I am writing I just take a step down and dont post a comment although I really enjoy your and others efforts of giving us a detailed reviews of either diecast or plastic models. I always do. And others, too.

In mid 2020 I switched from 1/400 to 1/200 (although I had some LH Modell Edition 747s in my collection before). My first Gemini200 A340-600 in hand and being absolutely overwhelmed I realized that I had to re-think this hobby. The big ones are way more expensive. By the end of last year I just got 12 models instead of 30 (in 1/400) for 1.500EUR/ 1.800USD. And all my models so far are near to my understanding of perfection. They're heavy, amazingly detailed and big. So to say I am a bit spoiled now. Accuracy in printing, parts and finishing is what I expect. And a detachable landing gear. Unfortunetaly because of that I have to pass all Inflight 747 and many other great releases.

Nevertheless this understanding of perfection doesn't mean if a wanted model has some issues I wont get it. The Gemini200 Malaysia 737-800 is a good example. The cockpit window printing looks odd, but as I've flown on its 1:1 pendant the wrong printing wasnt a reason not to get it. Just having some good memories and enjoying the model. I just hope all manufacturers keep improving their models and have a decent quality control. That's it.

Edit: some of my 2020 additions (enjoy! ):
Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers-dsc_4949.jpg
Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers-dsc_5048.jpg
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Old 01-14-2021, 12:23 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Love that DLH A346.
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Old 01-14-2021, 12:30 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I also think it is ridiculous to take a photo of an error and then magnify it by 20x. You're going to find a lot of different things wrong if that's the way you view models. I'm more about things that you can really notice with the naked eye -- smudges, incorrect paint color (I know you and I are going to disagree on this one, Russ but I think the Gemini UA 727 battleship is completely off).

With that being said, I don't think anybody is really going to change their minds. No point in losing any sleep over it. As a former boss would say, "Don't ever let someone else steal your joy."
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Old 01-14-2021, 12:57 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Well said crownvic,I could not of said it better, in the modeling communities I run I made it a rule if one is going to be so nitpicky about such minuscule things their topic will be removed and it really works fine of course models will have issues they are made by people that barely have knowledge of aerospace engineering they get design plans from their company and the workers follow orders I never been to a company like Inflight 200, Gemini Jets or JC Wings but I don't think its as wonderful as most would want to see it.

Even if models aren't perfect I also buy what I find important to have in my collection we all buy what we love and those that are here to disrupt it will get a not so positive reply in return they are only here to disrupt a positive mind and nothing more.

And it's fine to not like something it's just the method they use to constantly whine about the same thing over and over again, that doesn't read as pleasant commentary.

Aussijets & I always try to make a topic beautiful with good details, so people love them and we will gladly continue on doing just that.

It takes me about 4 a 5 days to do one of those topics a lot of time and work goes in to them from photo making to drafting to finalizing, it's un and it gives others a good perspective on what to expect from the model I am reviewing I try anyway
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Old 01-14-2021, 01:45 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Well said crownvic,

It takes me about 4 a 5 days to do one of those topics a lot of time and work goes in to them from photo making to drafting to finalizing, it's un and it gives others a good perspective on what to expect from the model I am reviewing I try anyway
that may explain why my photos are so bad, I just put them down, turn on a light, snap a photo with my phone and post. Total time 3-5 minutes!
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Old 01-14-2021, 02:37 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Yes, the "Micrometer Mob" do seem to be raising their heads above the parapet more and more these days, and perhaps for reasons mentioned above, but yes I think some of them now actively await a particular manufacturers new release pictures in order to go and shoot them down. Particularly in my favoured 1:400 scale where large high definition jpegs can reveal a multitude of sins not readily noticeable to the naked eye. Genuine mistakes like wrong colours or gold on B-Cal models twice when it's been declared wrong before do deserve criticism though.

I also agree with the assertion that manufacturers do back off from participation on these fora and elsewhere because of excessive criticisms of their product. NG in particular have embraced this forum in recent times (The L-1011 moulds are effectively in existence because of conversations and exchanges of ideas with DAC members) but within less than two years I can sense the reticence already. And I don't think the excessive nitpickers actually realise the harm they're doing in that respect.

To sum up, fair or constructive criticism is a vital part of the hobby, extreme criticism ( especially when the things being complained about are subject to debate and divided opinion) is not always condusive to happy collecting for anyone.

Good points Russ. Now will anyone bring me some nice British Caledonian releases in either scale, in 2021 that does NOT have a garish golden cheatline along it ?
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Old 01-14-2021, 03:36 PM   #30 (permalink)
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that may explain why my photos are so bad, I just put them down, turn on a light, snap a photo with my phone and post. Total time 3-5 minutes!
There are times I shoot like 200+ photo's and only 40 make it out. still I need to improve my skills my camera is the Sony CyberShot DSC-V3, here a decent review of it:
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/sonydscv3

The DSC-V3 was one of the best handhelds of 2003-2004 for it's price class.

It came with a mini tri-pod, never used that tho, I just hold my breath til my body is in absolute stably to make that good shot.
Photography is also a hobby of mine and combining that with them B747 diecast models is quite the challenge, my best photo hmm maybe this one for now:


And this one maybe, hmm hard to choose I guess

Tupolev Tu-144D
CCCP-77112
Aeroflot
Sinsheim Auto-Technik Museum, Germany (2017)


That are two of my favorite photo's for sure

For a look back in my Sinsheim & Speyer 2017 thread it's all here, had a fun day shooting pics made over 700 I think these in this topic were definitely the best ones I managed to sort out, was fun to do though!
https://www.diecastaircraftforum.com...er-2017-a.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by KLM4me View Post
I remember the days when I first started collecting 1:200 when we were thrilled just to get ANYTHING produced in this scale. When we'd BEG the airlines to send us corporate models because they wouldn't make them available on the retail level. (Virgin and Qatar come to mind!) Now there are collectors who complain about the position of pax windows, the size and/or shape of the cockpit windows, the shape of the engines and their position in relation to the ground (that one kills me) and the stance. That said, I don't care much for the IF200 747 mould, but if they were to release a model I had to have, then I'd certainly buy it.

One thing I noticed recently is that DAC members don't care about plastic models. I recently posted photos of my 2 latest acquisitions. Both models of actual aircraft I've flown on so they were special to me. I spent 40 minutes taking photos, posting to Flickr then copying and pasting and creating a post on here to share my joy. You were the only one to comment, Russell. robertjon5 received the same lack of response recently when he posted photos of his 2 Skymarks BA 744s. What happened to the camaraderie on here? The models may not be everyone's cup of tea, but be happy for the person who acquired them. It's very disheartening and I came close to completely deleting my profile on here.
Agreeds plastic models need more love, Herpa & Hogan especially made some damn fine molds tbh, it is a shame they are disrespected same for Skymarks, not that I'd buy these I still think when someone posts their PVC Collection that they too should get the same respect everyone else gets, at some time we all had PVC models and we loved them too and there are still some PVC models I'd love to get, it does not always have to be diecast.

Every model will have it's little things good or less grand, but that won't stop me from buying them, especially for my collection needs.
As most know here, I really adore the Boeing 747 in every way possible these models surely help a lot to bring them in the best perspective possible.
And do they have flaws here and there, I just accept that instead, much less stress to mind that way, and trust me from a distance you'd won't see them minuscule mistakes anyways so who the f*ck cares

You will never see me write off someone's post all due to such things, it's not the idea to rain down negativity on someone's liking's, all because something isn't well made or has flaws, you just don't do that, but sadly these nitpickers will always have their ways with such things and that is depressing to see happen.

It's fine not to like things it really is!, but there is just no need to bring that to those that deprive such posts, left alone make several threads always about the same things, it's wrong.
I hope to see you get that KLM Livery you love most some day, need help finding one I'd love to help ya always though <3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lufthansaboy View Post
I totally agree Russell. I notice it more on 1/400 though and it's always the same whingers.
These whiners are everywhere man, even in the Starwars & Dino vintage toy forums, in my communities I have a rule that such topics aren't aloud, just to keep the peace, it's fine to not like something but they should leave it at that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockybudgeboa View Post
6-7 years ago, when my daughter and I began collecting, I did not care if there were any issues and they did not bother me. What bothered me then and now is the certain somebodies who complained about every post I made. So, we decided to tune it down, and now we only got one model all of last year.

I still like my models as does my daughter, but we got sick of all the infantile keyboard warriors flacking us, so we took a huge step back so to speak and sold off a large majority of our diecast collection. Still have some which are never going to leave and plenty of plastics too.
Never stop doing what you love doing don't let these negativity seeders ruin on what you love doing, I won't let them win, no chance, I miss your threads though, always packed with detail, would be nice to see you come back though!

Quote:
Originally Posted by crownvic View Post
Its important to note the forum rules too:

"Photo threads are not to be used for model bashing. Another thread can be opened to show the shortfalls of the model and have healthy discussions on them. Photos need to be used with owner consent only. Threads/post will be removed if owner’s permissions have not been taken"
Best rule ever, seems like I will use this rule in my communities as well, it just makes sense.
Only if using an other photo from someone else it's best to mail the owner for permission and add credit to the owner of the photo if posting it, that is something I do take use of, giving credit should always be done and I will admit I too made mistakes of this in the past, I am sure everyone did at some point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aviaction View Post
Yes the original paint would be the same, but fades quickly, so at an airport you would see Pan Am billboards in different shades of blue - or any airline for that matter. So your display is more realistic of the real world....?
This is only understandable for those that get how damaging the sun's UV rays are, more in depth info here on why the Sun's UV rays cause Decoloration
https://www.loc.gov/everyday-mysteri...color-to-fade/

Quote:
Originally Posted by arctic9048 View Post
I also think it is ridiculous to take a photo of an error and then magnify it by 20x. You're going to find a lot of different things wrong if that's the way you view models. I'm more about things that you can really notice with the naked eye -- smudges, incorrect paint color (I know you and I are going to disagree on this one, Russ but I think the Gemini UA 727 battleship is completely off).

With that being said, I don't think anybody is really going to change their minds. No point in losing any sleep over it. As a former boss would say, "Don't ever let someone else steal your joy."
Well said those that do photography will love this post, me being one of them hehe
Yea from a distance of even 1 meter /3.3 feet you wont see these differences that much, some take such things way too deep, that is what I am experiencing anyway.

-----------
All along side that in the end I just want everyone to enjoy on what they love doing most, there will always be things that are less liked and that is highly respected but yea as said earlier.
There is no need to keep repeating that subjectit's old and everybody gets it.

Well I too been nitpicky of the jeweled landing lights lacking in GJ200 models and I too won't do that anymore, looking back it wasn't all worth mentioning multiple times as I have done, that was wrong of me to do.
I just didn't understand the reason, but agreed I took that a bit too far at times, my bad for that.

GJ200 still makes fantastic models and I still highly recommend them but IF200 is also great for those that love classic liveries every brand has their ups and downs in the end and it's all okay
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Old 01-14-2021, 03:50 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

The beauty of digital. Back in the day I used 35mm slide film which was the cheapest way to go. Didn't worry too much about wasting film. Now there's zero worry.
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Old 01-14-2021, 04:52 PM   #32 (permalink)
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The beauty of digital. Back in the day I used 35mm slide film which was the cheapest way to go. Didn't worry too much about wasting film. Now there's zero worry.
Well digital cameras's vary a lot tho color filters you name it,even they aren't perfect, but the image quality & fidelity of the photographic method has been greatly improved yes

Digital photo's will only improve over time as new methods will be applied and such.

But don't under estimate the classics from Nikon, Sony, Olympus, Pentax & Polaroid, some people still prefer these over a digital camera and can still deliver amazing results.
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Old 01-14-2021, 05:01 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Russell, video number 2 is actually in production....

OMG!!! Looking forward to it
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Old 01-14-2021, 06:39 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Old 01-16-2021, 11:18 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

For me, if the model is a good representation of the real thing, then I’m happy.

I’ve read and heard lots of criticism of various manufacturers but if I like them, I’ll buy them.

I used to be a regular visitor to this site when I first joined, every day I would check in and contribute where I could; I think that I too got fed up with the constant bickering and sniping (although mostly on the 1:400 section) and got put off to a certain extent.

I did start posting photos of my collection of aircraft that I had flown in and some of my other models years ago but for various reasons, I lost interest. I check in here infrequently now as I have other interests but still find it interesting now and then.

Enjoy your collecting.
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Old 01-16-2021, 12:34 PM   #36 (permalink)
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I've dumped all these stupid, modern day 1:200 and 1:400 models and gone back to schback 1:600!

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Old 01-16-2021, 02:10 PM   #37 (permalink)
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I've dumped all these stupid, modern day 1:200 and 1:400 models and gone back to schback 1:600!

If this is correct, I have a few 1/600 models for sale if you are interested! Cheers! T7
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Old 01-16-2021, 11:22 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

I wish I was more of a nitpicker, otherwise I wouldn't be so bl**dy addicted!!
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Norfolk air 737-200 (VH-OZD)
Ozjet 737-200 (VH-OZU)
Air Nauru 737-300 N/C, 727-100 (C2-RN4)
Australian Air express 727-100 VH-TBS
Heavy lift 727's (RP-C8019 and 9L-LEK)
Kalitta air DC-8's
PAWA Dominicana DC-9-30 (HI965)
TAB Cargo Bolivia DC/MD-10-30 (CP-2791)
LAB 727-200 (last c/s)
Amerijet 727-200 (N495AJ) Before it got fitted with wingles. Circa 1999
Raya airways 727-200 (Last C/S)
Neptune air 727-200 (9M-NEP)
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Old 01-16-2021, 11:53 PM   #39 (permalink)
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At least that window line is on point!
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Old 01-18-2021, 01:50 AM   #40 (permalink)
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The problem that nobody cares to mention is the hobby itself:

Collecting.

What is a collector? It's a person with discretionary capital who has little to no input on the design, manufacture or distribution of the item being collected. There's the model makers and then there's us; the collector/consumer.

You seriously wanna know why collectors ***** so much? It's because these things are incredibly expensive, limited in release and often slow to arrive with pre-orders being a must for new releases. Collectors have little power in the process and so they come here to complain. Where else can they go? Diecast collecting is a niche and aircraft diecast collecting is more niche than that!

So you're annoyed at all the whiners and complainers...OK. So I take it you're also just fine with the seemingly endless "Wishlist threads" and "I wish GJ, IF200, BB, NG, etc would make...threads". Sorry but nobody is going to make your 1:200 Boeing 720 that flew for Obscure Airlines back in 1969 for a total of 3 months before going bankrupt. These threads are just as annoying but were it not for any complaints at all, there would be no forum. Might as well shut the whole thing down or merge it with Airliners.net.

Bottom line: This is not a interactive/social hobby and as a result people will complain. Best to just deal with it warts and all.
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Old 01-18-2021, 04:16 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Well I run several model communities one with 300-ish people, the other with 500-ish people and no one is all that nitpicky not complains about minuscule things, my friend AussieJets can know this

It's the same when some try hard to make a problem the size of an ant in to the size of an elephant, that is all I am seeing really and it's strange to me that this can really bother some people to exceeding levels.

We all know that no model is 100% perfect, in my communities people love showing their models collections and sharing their experiences and the results are more than just positive, I mean this too can happen in a forum just as well, only if you want it to of course.

Negativity isn't liked for most, it takes away some people's happiness in the items they collect, or love to share with others, also why I would never rant of someone's things all because I would see a flaw in the design, that would only leave them in a neglected state.

Many people are just bored of seeing the same repetitive comments by the same people over and over again, it's not going to solve their problem, it's an on going repetitive scene of negativity.

it's fine that some of you won't agree with me, your choice, but I respect that
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Old 01-18-2021, 06:44 AM   #42 (permalink)
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We all know that no model is 100% perfect, in my communities people love showing their models collections and sharing their experiences and the results are more than just positive, I mean this too can happen in a forum just as well, only if you want it to of course.
You think it’s positive, others think it’s just nice or a kind of exhibitionism or even pompousness. What is right, what is wrong? Actually, it does not matter. All these feelings or, simply spoken, point of views are okay and as diversified as the collectorate is.

Your description of ‘positive’ would rather lead to a platform where collectors can present what they have with everyone’s applauding. This would not be a ‘discussion forum’.

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Negativity isn't liked for most, it takes away some people's happiness in the items they collect, or love to share with others, also why I would never rant of someone's things all because I would see a flaw in the design, that would only leave them in a neglected state.
I think your words are pointing straight towards the real problem: taking criticism as ‘negativity’. This problem is obviously based on the fact that ‘criticism’ is either mixed-up or deliberately put on the same level as senseless complaints or apparently exaggerated attention to detail. what's the reason? May be it's a certain incompetence in dealing with criticism in general. This is very unfortunate but obvious - and it’s the complete opposite to the natural meaning of a ‘discussion forum’.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold Leader View Post
Many people are just bored of seeing the same repetitive comments by the same people over and over again, it's not going to solve their problem, it's an on going repetitive scene of negativity.
May be this helps to add a different view: ”Many people are just bored of seeing the same ignorant comments by the same people over and over again, telling them criticism is just nit-picky, complaining and whining”.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold Leader View Post
it's fine that some of you won't agree with me, your choice, but I respect that
We don’t need to agree to everyone’s view - it would help if we could just respect what others have to say.

And if you are bored personally: skip those threads and topics. Tell the writer about your point - I think one can always say: “Sorry man but this details is not of interest to me”. Or just say nothing and leave the topic to those who are interested in discussing it. Just an idea.

By the way, some criticism even bothers me from time to time. But that’s a natural thing. The 1/400 scale has taken this to a higher level recently. But that’s just a sidenote.
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Gemini200: Condor 757-300 (1999 delivery cs.), Condor 757-300WL (2004 white/blue/yellow cs. with 'Condor' titles)
Inflight200: Martinair 767-300ER (1990's 'Martinair Holland' c/s), Hapag-Lloyd A310-200/-300, LTU-Süd Boeing 757-200, Swiss A330-300 & A340-300 (both in 2003 c/s)
NG Models: Binter Mediterráneo CASA CN-235
HerpaWings: Spantax Dash 7

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Old 01-18-2021, 09:46 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Generally speaking, I can't see anything wrong with pointing out errors. On the basis that errors are different for every collector. It can be a deal breaker for one and for another, not a big deal. The last thing a collector wants is unboxing a model and finding a deal breaking error, that could have been avoided if it was mentioned on a forum. In that respect, it's useful to "rivet count".

Where it becomes an annoyance is when it's taken too far. To the extent of brand bashing and saying what pos models that manufacturer puts out. That they don't care about collectors and retailers all over the world are pi$$ed off with constantly dumping those pos models

Absolutely out of touch with reality. Manufacturers are a business and the models they sell must make a profit for them... and it's ulitmately the market who decides if the manufacturer is going to make money. Constantly producing loss making models will result in said manufacturer going under. You do already have an example of a kind... Hobby master. The last time they released a jetliner was back in 2015. Obviously the market said "NO" to their models and HM stopped making them

So, okay to mention errors, flaws etc but keep in mind the big picture... that if IF200 continually release a 727 with all its well known errors, it can only be because the market is fine with it. If the tooling makes a profit for IF200 then there's very little incentive for them to correct the flaws
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Old 01-18-2021, 10:33 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Like so many other things in life, you need to ignore the noise.

We all know people in our lives that constantly whine and complain about every little thing. A woman at work complaints non-stop and the overwhelming majority of her complaints are, in my opinion, completely idiotic. Improving your tuning out skills will go a long way. I generally ignore most of what she is saying but there are certain keywords that let me know if it's something I need to listen to -- mostly because it would be related to work.
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Old 01-18-2021, 02:14 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Like so many other things in life, you need to ignore the noise.

We all know people in our lives that constantly whine and complain about every little thing. A woman at work complaints non-stop and the overwhelming majority of her complaints are, in my opinion, completely idiotic. Improving your tuning out skills will go a long way. I generally ignore most of what she is saying but there are certain keywords that let me know if it's something I need to listen to -- mostly because it would be related to work.
I worked with a woman like that. It was a complete downer to hear her all day. I think people like that are basically unhappy. My tune out skills were honed immensely, however.
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Old 01-18-2021, 04:47 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

A thread like this is very repetitive, it will always contain that same kind of reaction you will expect from those same kind of people disliking certain things or minor details making their minuscule complaints in to the size of Titanosaurs.

That is all I see in these pointless threads, but hey if you like crying over a piece of metal, go for it
You must do what you feel is right, of course ^^
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Last edited by Gold Leader; 01-18-2021 at 04:55 PM.
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Old 01-19-2021, 03:50 AM   #47 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gold Leader View Post
A thread like this is very repetitive, it will always contain that same kind of reaction you will expect from those same kind of people disliking certain things or minor details making their minuscule complaints in to the size of Titanosaurs.

That is all I see in these pointless threads, but hey if you like crying over a piece of metal, go for it
You must do what you feel is right, of course ^^
Sure it is repetitive since people having their own (and, most of the time, always the same) point of view on things. This goes for collectors criticizing certain aspects of a defective or insufficiently produced model, and it of course goes for people like you who are in principle against any kind (or most of) criticism as well. That’s it. Still, reason, objectivity, acceptance and respect shall be the basic conditions for all.
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Gemini200: Condor 757-300 (1999 delivery cs.), Condor 757-300WL (2004 white/blue/yellow cs. with 'Condor' titles)
Inflight200: Martinair 767-300ER (1990's 'Martinair Holland' c/s), Hapag-Lloyd A310-200/-300, LTU-Süd Boeing 757-200, Swiss A330-300 & A340-300 (both in 2003 c/s)
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Old 01-21-2021, 06:55 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by KLM4me View Post
I remember the days when I first started collecting 1:200 when we were thrilled just to get ANYTHING produced in this scale. When we'd BEG the airlines to send us corporate models because they wouldn't make them available on the retail level. (Virgin and Qatar come to mind!) Now there are collectors who complain about the position of pax windows, the size and/or shape of the cockpit windows, the shape of the engines and their position in relation to the ground (that one kills me) and the stance. That said, I don't care much for the IF200 747 mould, but if they were to release a model I had to have, then I'd certainly buy it.

One thing I noticed recently is that DAC members don't care about plastic models. I recently posted photos of my 2 latest acquisitions. Both models of actual aircraft I've flown on so they were special to me. I spent 40 minutes taking photos, posting to Flickr then copying and pasting and creating a post on here to share my joy. You were the only one to comment, Russell. robertjon5 received the same lack of response recently when he posted photos of his 2 Skymarks BA 744s. What happened to the camaraderie on here? The models may not be everyone's cup of tea, but be happy for the person who acquired them. It's very disheartening and I came close to completely deleting my profile on here.
I still remember the days of all the oohs and aahs over plastic models indeed. Especially with the hype over the Qatar corporate models. Like you did just now I would spend so much time taking pics of the models and then upload to Flickr and post here.

While I just got one diecast widebody I can understand how some might feel towards asric but they have their advantages, light in weight and on the wallet too.

I returned here after all these years specifically to sell some Hogans, Herpas and Risesoon/ Skymarks. However not sure if they would even be looked at lol.

Don't stop the pics. Your BA 744s are gorgeous.
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Old 01-21-2021, 07:52 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

IMO, this “community” is like every other. There are people with whom you share an opinion, those with whom you disagree. Some people are “talkative” and post more than others, but sometimes, as in real life, it pays to take notice when otherwise quiet voices are heard. The key is to keep it civil and on topic. There is a Squawk Talk section for a reason.

It’s a hobby. If you no longer enjoy it, then stop, or at least avoid those aspects that annoy you. Ignore threads that you find frustrating and participate in those that don’t.

We all have our flaws. Some of us (me!) have ready access to a picture library and feel compelled to show off our collection at every opportunity, but I for one come here for the photos, especially of those models that I would like to see, but would probably never buy, so the more pictures the better.

Others want to impress with their knowledge. Is that so bad? If you don’t want to read, then move along, but don’t attack.

I have had people be critical of some of my customs because they are not a perfect representation of the 1:1. In many cases, they are right! Some of my world tail 757s have the wrong engines! Heresy! But you know what..? I don’t care. My goal was to have every tail, but there was no suitable donor model for the earlier BA 757s, so I used the latter models and I love every one and achieved my goal. The same goes for some other airframes that I did not see too much In real life. If in my (failing) eyes, the model represents my memories (also failing), then I am good to go.

Someone once told me to “make like a mallard”....and have criticism and negativity be “water off a duck’s back”. Good advice.

That said, constant negativity will poison any community. Celebrate the positive, acknowledge the challenges and flaws, but let people make up their own mind, and as has been said, “like what you buy and buy what you like”.

The “community” will “self select” the tone that becomes prevalent. The best option (again IMO) is to make the parts of the community that you enjoy be more active than those that you don’t, by participating in a way that you would hope people would participate in threads that you would typically start.

If I get to the point where this is a place that I don’t enjoy, then I will move on, but for now it is the most active of the places that I could frequent, and the pros outweigh the cons.
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Old 01-21-2021, 08:21 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Default Re: Nitpickers Whiners and Complainers

Quote:
Originally Posted by ukjohna View Post
IMO, this “community” is like every other. There are people with whom you share an opinion, those with whom you disagree. Some people are “talkative” and post more than others, but sometimes, as in real life, it pays to take notice when otherwise quiet voices are heard. The key is to keep it civil and on topic. There is a Squawk Talk section for a reason.

It’s a hobby. If you no longer enjoy it, then stop, or at least avoid those aspects that annoy you. Ignore threads that you find frustrating and participate in those that don’t.

We all have our flaws. Some of us (me!) have ready access to a picture library and feel compelled to show off our collection at every opportunity, but I for one come here for the photos, especially of those models that I would like to see, but would probably never buy, so the more pictures the better.

Others want to impress with their knowledge. Is that so bad? If you don’t want to read, then move along, but don’t attack.

I have had people be critical of some of my customs because they are not a perfect representation of the 1:1. In many cases, they are right! Some of my world tail 757s have the wrong engines! Heresy! But you know what..? I don’t care. My goal was to have every tail, but there was no suitable donor model for the earlier BA 757s, so I used the latter models and I love every one and achieved my goal. The same goes for some other airframes that I did not see too much In real life. If in my (failing) eyes, the model represents my memories (also failing), then I am good to go.

Someone once told me to “make like a mallard”....and have criticism and negativity be “water off a duck’s back”. Good advice.

That said, constant negativity will poison any community. Celebrate the positive, acknowledge the challenges and flaws, but let people make up their own mind, and as has been said, “like what you buy and buy what you like”.

The “community” will “self select” the tone that becomes prevalent. The best option (again IMO) is to make the parts of the community that you enjoy be more active than those that you don’t, by participating in a way that you would hope people would participate in threads that you would typically start.

If I get to the point where this is a place that I don’t enjoy, then I will move on, but for now it is the most active of the places that I could frequent, and the pros outweigh the cons.
One of the best posts I have read on the DAC in some time! I admire and respect your personal thoughts and feelings with your post above. Well done! T7
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