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Old 11-01-2019, 07:09 AM   #1
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Default Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Dear members,

I am usually very enthusiastic about models. Because I love airplanes.
But also because the models are of increasingly higher quality over the years. I mean: over the decades. Because in recent years I also see a decline. Some top brands are becoming easier to live up to their own high level of detail.

The Gemini200 DC-3 C-GPNR of Buffalo Airways was and is one of my model muse. It is an unprecedentedly beautiful mold with a tampo print that is indistinguishable from real life. The level of detail: fantastic! I love it...

But then the new Gemini200 KLM DC-3 was released yesterday (of course: its a C47A). Polished wings, it seems that the details in the livery correspond well with reality. There is nothing to complain about that. But still something seems to be wrong... have a look:






Do you see what I mean? Compare it with the previous KLM edition of Gemini. The 'balls and stripes' livery of PH-DAR. First look at the stand that is included. I don't want to impose an opinion, but there is a difference, isn't it?

And now its really gonna hurt:





De windows on the PH-DAZ are to large and way to high on the fuselage. The cockpit window seems to make a strange turn downwards to make it connect to the nose section. The cheat line and banner pinches and pulls on all sides.

And then the fun rotating and spinning tail wheel (once a strong point of the Gemini200 DC-3):



Speaks for itself, right? Anyway my opinion: I am disappointed.
The only question that remains; Gemini, where did your amazing DC-3 go wrong?
And what can we expect in the future? The bare metal version?, the Crown logo version? Don't get me wrong: I'm really looking forward to that. But then at the level of 5 years ago please. Or should we now place our hope on Herpa. Because I'm looking forward to the new DC-4 PH-TAR. This one seems to be old-fashionable great!

cheers, VJ

Last edited by Vintage Jet; 11-02-2019 at 06:46 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 11-01-2019, 08:58 AM   #2
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

You are right, the window Line is too high.
I have an aircraft boneyard that will accept it and put it out of its misery.
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Old 11-01-2019, 09:41 AM   #3
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

I agree with you on the windows VJ.
They seem a little out of place compared to the cockpitwindows. The side cockpit window appears somewhat out of shape.
The cheatline looks fine to me.

As far as the stand is concerned; it's different, but not necessarily worse. I think its size fits the DC-3 better than the previous one.

Looking forward to pick it up at the store.
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Old 11-01-2019, 10:25 AM   #4
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

@HTF200, thanks for the offer. Nevertheless she will first have to log some hours in my display case first ;-)

@Maarlandair, It might just be a matter of taste. Be careful though. In contrast to the black ones, one of the new transparent connectors broke almost immediately when the legs were inserted.
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Old 11-01-2019, 03:35 PM   #5
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

It appears the cockpit windows got printed on an angle and are diving into the nose.
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Old 11-01-2019, 06:20 PM   #6
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

I will keep my mouth shut....

https://www.diecastaircraftforum.com...rol-issue.html
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Old 11-01-2019, 08:13 PM   #7
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

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It appears the cockpit windows got printed on an angle and are diving into the nose.
Yes—that 'frown' and the slightly oversized windows. Hopefully Gemini will rectify this before the next release. No doubt, they've got the best mould, but the good news is—this is only a tampo fix.

I too am watching that Herpa DC-4 too.
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Last edited by Upkeep; 11-01-2019 at 09:16 PM. Reason: Addition for clarity
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Old 11-02-2019, 04:11 AM   #8
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Windows are to high indeed, nevertheless a must have for me!
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Old 11-02-2019, 05:08 AM   #9
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Some time ago Herpa produced a DC 3 with the KLM livery on the left side and AF on the right side.

Not the best mould, engines, top of the vertical fin ...

The Pitot tubes are a nice touch on the Gemini model.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 11-02-2019, 08:49 AM   #10
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
Some time ago Herpa produced a DC 3 with the KLM livery on the left side and AF on the right side.

Not the best mould, engines, top of the vertical fin ...

The Pitot tubes are a nice touch on the Gemini model.
True for sure! The mould of Gemini's DC-3 is very nice. And the additional items makes it kind of irresistible: the details of the engines, pitot tubes and even the beacon light. Therefore it is a must have after all, as Baerke stated.
My criticism does not come from nagging, but from respect for a premium model. And then I also hope for a premium finish.
Like the recent Herpa KLM L1049: if the mould is too far off (in my eyes) I'am not even considering a purchase. Having said that: please bring us Western Models and even Hobby Master Connies! I have a HM NC-121 and its still a highlight in my collection.

By the way; nice that you have one of the most appropriate liveries applied to PH-PBA. Nevertheless, the real one is now back in its original 'Royal' colors (1947-1960). Time for a 1/200 from Gemini? With correctly placed decals please ;-)

cheers, VJ
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Old 11-03-2019, 05:50 AM   #11
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Added the KLM Gemini DC-3 yesterday.
I do like the model. It suits well with its two sisters, including a C-47 in WWII orange.
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Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)-20191103_103650.jpg   Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)-20191103_103731.jpg   Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)-20191103_103903.jpg   Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)-20191103_103926.jpg  
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Old 11-03-2019, 07:19 AM   #12
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Wow that orange one is nice! Custom build on gemini mold?
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Old 11-03-2019, 07:40 AM   #13
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Well done Marc, nice addition to your KLM fleet.
Sometimes, the best way to have the model you want is to make your own using an already existing mould.
Not easy on small models but always gratifying.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 11-03-2019, 08:24 AM   #14
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Thanks guys. Just a Hasegawa model with some custom decals. I have not tried my luck with metal models yet.

I do like to make the occasional model myself, specially if it not likely it will be made in larger numbers. I have been wrong a few times though.
Specially Inflight is catching up with me, with a few of their more recent announcements.
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Old 11-03-2019, 08:30 AM   #15
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Great model Marc! Impressive work. I'd rather aks you to to some custom work iso waiting for another Gemini ;-) Were did you get the decals from? You inspired me to give the orange one a try!
I used the 1/200 Hasegawa DC-3's once for two custom Buffalo Airways models (bought at Wentink, we are almost neighbors). Hasegawa has an excellent mould and I really like their DC-3.

Cheers, VJ
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Old 11-03-2019, 08:54 AM   #16
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How about that. I do know Wentink!

I just had a go at the decals myself on my computer and asked the people behind the below mentioned webshop to print them for me.

https://www.paperspecials.nl/nl/

I am not quite sure if they still do the printing,or only selling decal sheets nowadays, since the webshop has been sold to different owners.
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Old 11-03-2019, 11:04 AM   #17
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Very disappointing execution. Was looking forward to it but will have to pass on this one.
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Old 11-03-2019, 10:55 PM   #18
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

It doesn't bother me. I understand some people can't live with the mistakes and that is their right. I LOVE mine and got 2
Bring on more DC-3's PLEASE PAA Delivery
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Old 11-04-2019, 11:58 AM   #19
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

What was the reason for the existence of this Orange 'Holland' DC-3?
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Old 11-04-2019, 03:27 PM   #20
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

As the Netherlands were neutral in ww2 in the beginning of the war, they painted their civil aircrafts orange with big Holland titles so they would be spared by fighter planes. But it only was short lived as the Germans invated the Netherlands anyway.
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Old 11-04-2019, 04:43 PM   #21
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maarlandair View Post
Thanks guys. Just a Hasegawa model with some custom decals. I have not tried my luck with metal models yet.

I do like to make the occasional model myself, specially if it not likely it will be made in larger numbers. I have been wrong a few times though.
Specially Inflight is catching up with me, with a few of their more recent announcements.
I did not not know Hasegawa made 1:200 DC-3 model kits. I must look into this, as I'd like a Canadian Pacific Airlines one and nobody seems interested in making a decent one. (And nooooo . . . the HM one doesn't qualify)
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Old 11-04-2019, 05:02 PM   #22
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

I am not sure if you are referring to this livery, probably not, but is sure looks awesome on a DC-3 (talking about orange)!
I miss these colourful aircraft at Schiphol airport.
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Old 11-04-2019, 06:46 PM   #23
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I am not sure if you are referring to this livery, probably not, but is sure looks awesome on a DC-3 (talking about orange)!
I miss these colourful aircraft at Schiphol airport.
Actually, the orange I find most disgusting and brutally industrial—so similar to the dirty freight trains still rolling around with that 'livery'. No, I'm more interested in the mid-50's & 1961 livery.
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Old 11-04-2019, 07:09 PM   #24
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Oddly enough, when CPA 'modernized' their livery in 1961 to coincide with the arrive of the Jet Age and CPA's new DC-8-43s, they painted the remaining DC-3s in the new livery too. All of the legacy fleet, excepting the Convair 240s, got the treatment. I had some photos of these DC-3s in the 1961 livery I took at our airport in Prince George, B.C., in 1963 with my Kodak Brownie camera (I was 10) but I can't find my snaps or negs. Anyhow, below, the DC-8 CF-CPJ in the 1961 livery.
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Old 11-05-2019, 05:13 PM   #25
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Quote:
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Actually, the orange I find most disgusting and brutally industrial—so similar to the dirty freight trains still rolling around with that 'livery'. No, I'm more interested in the mid-50's & 1961 livery.
Hope you find the Hasegawa DC-3 and create yourself one in this livery. I agree of course; This livery is a classic one and the orange looks pretty outragious on a DC-3.
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Old 11-06-2019, 03:45 AM   #26
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

I do like the orange CP livery, looked good on the then modern jet age stuff.

Neil.
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Old 11-06-2019, 11:30 AM   #27
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Time and time again we see windows/ cheatlines printed too high resulting in the cockpit windows being pushed up and distorted!! WHY???? This applies to several manufacturers making 1/200 and 1/400 models. This issue come up over and over again, but still they do it!
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Old 11-07-2019, 12:58 AM   #28
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Default Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

Quote:
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Hope you find the Hasegawa DC-3 and create yourself one in this livery. I agree of course; This livery is a classic one and the orange looks pretty outragious on a DC-3.
Yes, getting a kit isn't that hard, but the decals are proving to be a challenge.

The orange livery is popular with a lot of collectors. It does stand out. But I grew up with the earlier ones, hanging out at our airport doing odd jobs, etc., just to be around the aircraft. Just the way it was.
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Old 11-07-2019, 12:59 AM   #29
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Quote:
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I do like the orange CP livery, looked good on the then modern jet age stuff.

Neil.
A lot of collectors really like it.
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Old 11-07-2019, 03:49 AM   #30
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Quote:
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The orange livery is popular with a lot of collectors. It does stand out. But I grew up with the earlier ones, hanging out at our airport doing odd jobs, etc., just to be around the aircraft. Just the way it was.
A similar story applies to KLM and its fantastic livery.
When KLM (again) changed its livery during the sixties from the 'Balls and Stripes' (with diagonal lines and a red crown on the tail) to the 'Crown Logo', it met a lot of resistance both internally and externally at KLM. The design was made by Frederic Henrion and he based it on the 'Gestalt laws': reducing complex reality to simple, often cubist, forms. Back than people hated it and called it "the IBM crown" or "those four circles with that cross and a line" and "Pajama stripe livery" ;-)
Now, more than 50 years later, it is still sported on all KLM aircraft and in my humble opinion it is one of the most epic logos ever applied in aviation.




from right to left: the same aircraft in "The Flying Dutchman" livery (white top), "Balls and Stripes" livery and finally the basis for the livery sported until today: "The Crown Logo" livery. It just missed out the transition to blue tops, since the last DC-3 in this livery was decommissioned on 15 July 1970.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=XdRXoqgQBDs
A must see for DC-3 lovers. A recent find a film showing former KLM Aerocarto DC-3 PZ-TLC operating in Surinam. Still in its KLM colors.

cheers, VJ
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Old 11-07-2019, 08:25 AM   #31
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Smile Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

No doubt, as one who spend an entire career in professional design, I have run into that KLM mark on more than one occasion. It truly is remarkable, and yes, similar to IBM. It doesn't surprise me at all why collectors LOVE KLM. If I was asked to pick just one KLM livery as my favourite. I couldn't. There's too many in their history.
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Old 11-07-2019, 12:40 PM   #32
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Thumbs up Re: Gemini200 KLM DC-3 (or where it went wrong)

But to return to topic—yes, the earlier Gemini KLM DC-3 (as shown in the opening post) is an absolute cracker. Too bad this recent one is off mark, as it is ONLY a tampo printing miscalculation.

No question Genimi has the nicest DC-3 mould. Now if they would only do up my CPA DC-3 in 1961 livery . . . (I knew I had a photo somewhere)
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