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Old 10-09-2019, 08:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default UAL SE 210 Caravelle

My holy grail has been announced. Yeah!
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:34 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Unfortunately the related release artwork shows the wrong cockpit window layout for the little UAL French tart...maybe they will provide the correct, high visibility windscreen tampo on the actual release
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Old 10-10-2019, 06:01 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

I agree, this livery is very nice on a Caravelle.

But with a bit of effort, a bit more rigor and more attention to the early comments made before the model was released, these Caravelles could have been little gems.

This a Caravelle VI R, pray to have thrust reversers on the engines ...
...and please, no corroguard on the wing fences, ridiculous.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-10-2019, 02:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

... and please: with 'Horizon' cockpit windows and the short dorsal fin. The 6R was developed specially for the UAL order of 20 aircraft (unprecedented large order at the time) and was kind of a hybrid between the first Caravelle series (with Comet cockpit windows and howling Avons) and the upgraded models with JT8D's. A few of the UAL aircraft ended their career in service of Transavia. So IF this model has the details correct, I would also like a Transavia version! PH-TRX with its odd scheme or so ;-)

Fingers crossed, VJ
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Old 10-10-2019, 04:28 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Nice extra info Jean Pierre and VJ. Didn't know that. Was united the only American user of the Caravelle?
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Old 10-10-2019, 04:32 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

United was the only US carrier to order them.
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Old 10-10-2019, 04:47 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Thanks! Interested in this model, hope they do it right.
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Old 10-10-2019, 05:07 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Yes me too. The 1:400 that I have is woefully incorrect.
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Old 10-10-2019, 06:24 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baerke View Post
Was united the only American user of the Caravelle?
It was the only airline to order factory new aircraft. UAL introduced the Caravelle during the greatest expansion in the airline's 35 year history, following completion of its merger with Capital Airlines.
End '50 UAL had ordered DC-8's for its long range routes and Boeing 720's for medium-range routes. For the new short to medium haul fleet the most common candidate was the Lockheed Electra (like American and Eastern), but UAL president Patterson was dubious about turboprops to replace pistons.

Douglas, however, was heavily leveraged with the development and subsequent production problems and delays of the DC-8. Donald Douglas sr. was unwilling to commit to a new aircraft. Instead he embraced Sud Aviation as a partner. His words: "The DC-9: its the Caravelle".
With the Douglas-Sud Aviation pact in place, UAL was confident of technical support and signed a contract for 20 Caravelle's in 1960. Officially as an intermediate aircraft until the new Boeing 727 became available. The Caravelles finally lasted in UAL service until 1970.

The US Caravelle, equipped with GE engines, was named "Santa Maria". But American, Continental and National turned the airplane down. There was some enthusiasm for the Caravelle by TWA's Howerd Huge. But TWA was in the race for speed and ordered the Convair 880 instead, when the Caravelle could not deliver the requested cruise speed performance.
All the aerodynamic lessons and body modifications from the US adventure were finally processed in a new generation Caravelle's, from model 10 onward.

Only 27 Caravelle were sold under the Douglas flag and the friction between both companies rose during 1961, when development of model 10 was slow and model 14 not even materialized, due to large interest of Sud-Aviation in the Concorde project. At the end of 1961 the American adventure of the Caravelle ended and Douglas decided to give it a go with the new model, the DC-9. The rest of that story is well known...

thanks to John Wegg, whom I admire for his wonderful knowledge of the Caravelle and his fantastic book: 'Caravelle, the complete story". He passed away last year and will be missed.

cheers, VJ
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:53 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Very nice information. Hope to find that book you are talking about!
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:47 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

As a big fan of the Caravelle, I can attest to the fact that the John Wegg book is well worth seeking our.

Neil.
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:52 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

John Wegg's book is the definitive bible about the Caravelle.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:36 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
John Wegg's book is the definitive bible about the Caravelle.

Jean Pierre.

+1 excellent info.
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Old 10-15-2019, 11:58 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Happy with my John Wegg's Caravelle book since it was published. In the meantime it is almost falling apart. Hopefully this United Caravelle is without the dorsal fin, including bigger cockpit windows, and thrust reverse engines. If so, a Transavia Caravelle VIR in the latest livery please (PH-TRU). Next step, a Finnair Caravelle 10B3 but this is probably wishful thinking I guess....and finally a Sterling or Air Inter Caravelle 12. But at the moment I am already happy with the announced United Caravelle if it is a correct VIR.

Last edited by Caravelle10B3; 10-15-2019 at 06:42 PM.
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Old 10-17-2019, 11:33 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Here is my Western Models version I’ve had for over 10 years. A little crude by today’s standards but a keeper nevertheless..
Attached Thumbnails
UAL SE 210 Caravelle-8b864934-893c-4782-b250-ff451afe59fc.jpg   UAL SE 210 Caravelle-0d38e01a-534d-42e3-a73b-39e74c9f156e.jpg   UAL SE 210 Caravelle-8d1ea416-55f7-482c-9baa-050736bd2715.jpg   UAL SE 210 Caravelle-e1a8d343-290c-434b-a086-9039e94f56b2.jpg   UAL SE 210 Caravelle-f52ea0ca-c4a8-4d56-80ef-7dce5575bcf9.jpg  

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Old 10-18-2019, 07:38 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

[QUOTE=crownvic;2726722] A little crude QUOTE]

... but sweet...
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Old 10-18-2019, 09:22 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

The United Caravelle could be a great model.
The absence of the dorsal fin housing the HF antenna will eliminate one of the most noticeable inaccuracy of the Inflight Caravelle.

On the previous models, the dorsal fin looks too high above the fuselage when it joins the vertical fin and also, in this area, the too early reduced fuselage cross section does not help and makes the problem worse.
The top of the fuselage should remain on the same level, on the same horizontal line for a longer distance.

I mentioned this problem when i received pictures of the mould long time ago but I was not listened, my comments and the time I spent were a waste of time.

To improve the model I suggest Inflight to find a solution for the wing walk way, as I already said, the printing of the walkway on the wing fences is ridiculous.

Also, accurate printings of the cockpit windows and thrust reversers are something that the discerning collectors are expecting from Inflight.

For me, just like the Brexit, buying this model is a compromise between what I can accept and what I can't.
The Caravelle needs to be treated in the best way possible.

I need to be convinced.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-18-2019, 09:40 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Crownvic's model is the delivery livery. Inflight's appear to be the last version.
I prefer the delivery one, but if it's accurate I'll be happy.
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Old 10-18-2019, 10:48 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Nice model CROWNVIC...you going to add the IF version to your collection or too soon to tell?
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Old 10-18-2019, 12:40 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Nice model CROWNVIC...you going to add the IF version to your collection or too soon to tell?
most likely will add
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Old 10-19-2019, 10:47 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Me TOO!
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Old 10-19-2019, 06:19 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
For me, just like the Brexit, buying this model is a compromise between what I can accept and what I can't.
The Caravelle needs to be treated in the best way possible.
Well said my friend! The truly elegant design of the Caravelle stood as the epitome of French aesthetics for decades. And she still does today as one of the most beautiful airliners even built. 'La Belle Caravelle' deserves to have all the details right down to the highest level.
But I must admit that, despite the objections, I have also given in to the Transavia version. And with a next version I would do that again (please let it be an 6R and please no dorsal fin..., please?)

cheers, VJ

Last edited by Vintage Jet; 10-19-2019 at 06:48 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 10-20-2019, 01:58 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Love the Caravelle. I’m lucky enough to have flown on those of Transeuropa, Transwede and Sterling (10Bs and 12).

Neil.
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UAL SE 210 Caravelle-8d98bc0e-0ddb-4713-80e8-510aa0d21162.jpg  
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Old 11-24-2019, 02:39 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

Do we know if IF has corrected the flaws as noted in prior posts?
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Old 11-26-2019, 08:44 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: UAL SE 210 Caravelle

I got to fly on the China Airlines version in the early 70's...so I have the Hogan 1:200 metal release.
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Old 11-27-2019, 11:00 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcahea View Post
I got to fly on the China Airlines version in the early 70's...so I have the Hogan 1:200 metal release.
If I remember correctly, that was one of Hogan's that actually got the flightdeck windscreen correct. A peach, IMHO.
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Old 11-28-2019, 12:10 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Definitely a beauty!

I had the Swissair and Air France, but sold them years back.
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