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-   -   Modern Airliners vs Classics (https://www.diecastaircraftforum.com/1-200-scale-model-aircraft/163490-modern-airliners-vs-classics.html)

Zendocon 09-30-2015 01:07 PM

Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Does your collection consist of more modern airliners or more classics? Which do you prefer? Would you like to see more classics being released or are you happy with the trend towards more modern aircraft? Who collects both? I'm trying to get a feel for what people really want compared to what we're being delivered.

r3500vdp 09-30-2015 01:10 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
In my opinion there is too much focus on Asian / Arab Peninsula carriers in combination with B744 / B777 releases.

Yellow_Ribbon 09-30-2015 01:12 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Long live the classics. I started with mordern, but today's cattle transports are no match for the golden age of aviation. There is so much more about aviation if you look into the past, for today's aviation is derived from yesterdays.

Zendocon 09-30-2015 01:21 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
So far, I like what I'm hearing. There is a very vocal group in here who are adamant that nobody wants classics anymore and that companies need to focus on the modern planes, but I think there's a lot of demand for classic airliners here and there should be a more even split.

Maple 09-30-2015 01:22 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Classics. No question about it.

SouthwestAirlines103 09-30-2015 01:49 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I do both, mostly modern though. Classic for me is prior to 2000 but I have some DC-8's CV-880's DC-10 and 747-100's. I don't really collect anything prior to the 60's but I'm all for those being released. It's bitter sweet that the manufactures pump out so many releases per month. It is becoming difficult to keep up.

YOWguy 09-30-2015 02:43 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I tend to collect on a 'fleet' basis. This month we see for example an AC 789 - sure thing to buy one BUT where is the AC and TCA DC-8's, Wardairs 747, A300, DC-6, Nordair CV-990, and/or new release Russian 4 engine beasts as examples. How many Emirates, Singapore, Cathay and KLM collectors are out there and saturated?

F-28, CV-580, Dash-7, and L749 Connie all would sell like gangbusters if done well mold and livery selection wise. C-5 and C-141's are glaringly missing unless/even if one goes the ARD route.

heathpete 09-30-2015 03:11 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Most definitely the classics. The earlier days of aviation where a time of adventure, when the sight of a gleaming silver airliner passing overhead made one dream of far flung exotic lands. I also like to build up a fleet and it's always the 'golden oldies' that take pride of place in my collection. I flew half way around the world a couple of weeks back as I often do and spent the usual tedious hours at airports. Gazing out at the modern aircraft which are all basically the same shape and now mostly with two engines slung in the same place always puts me to sleep. Don't even start me on how they even spoil that look with stupid cartoon characters plastered all over them! Classic airliners in classic liveries for me!

Disclaimer : The views expressed in my post aren't necessarily those that I express every day. I haven't had much sleep so am therefore tired and cranky!

KLM4me 09-30-2015 03:20 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I currently own a very modest collection of only 35 1:200 scale models. Out of those, only five of them are modern. Three of them I own only because they are models of Disneyland-themed planes and I collect Disneyland memorabilia. The other two models of modern aircraft are 787s and I bought them after touring/viewing the 787 at Museum of Flight two weeks ago.

The bulk of my collection consists of B722s, L-1011s, and B741/B742s. I'm happy we've been seeing some classic airliners and liveries, such as the Delta widget 747, KLM delivery colors 747, ANZ old colors 747, and the re-release of the Eastern L-1011.

MORE PLEASE!

Zendocon 09-30-2015 03:32 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
So while most manufacturers are focused on modern planes, most of the consumers prefer the opposite? This is interesting.

AIR FRANCE 340 09-30-2015 03:42 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
What do you mean when saying modern airliners and classics ?

It could depend on how old you are, I am very tempted to say that for me a classic airliners have propellers and a modern aircraft have jet engines.

That said, I collect both and as far as my AF fleet is concerned, from 1933 to today.

I attach a picture of the Arc en Ciel, an home made model aircraft, the real plane was flown in 1933, and I have a few more …

DC 3s, Connies are classic aircraft, I flew on them, Caravelles and B 707s are modern airliners just like A 320s or B 747-400s, they were part of my life.
It as simple as that.

Jean Pierre.

AIR FRANCE 340 09-30-2015 03:44 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Sorry, I forgot the picture.

Jean Pierre.

KLM4me 09-30-2015 04:04 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
For me, a "modern" airliner would include 734-Max, 744-8, 767, 777, 787, MD-11, MD-80, any Airbus, etc.

A classic airliner would be any 727, DC-10, L-1011, DC-8, DC-9, and any propeller aircraft.

Zendocon 09-30-2015 04:06 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Are you saying that a Bombarier Q400 is a classic then? ;)

I would say that the term "classics" is certainly open to interpretation. Some would say that "modern" would refer to anything that is still in service and that everything else is classic. However, I would say that DC-3s, HS748s, 727s, 737-200s, and many other aircraft that are still in service would be considered classics.


Quote:

Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 (Post 1516458)
What do you mean when saying modern airliners and classics ?

I could depend on how old you are, I am very tempted to say that for me a classic airliners have propellers and a modern aircraft have jet engines.

That said, I collect both and as far as my AF fleet is concerned, from 1933 to today.

I attach a picture of the Arc en Ciel, an home made model aircraft, the real plane was flown in 1933, and I have a few more …

DC 3s, Connies are classic aircraft, I flew on them, Caravelles and B 707s are modern airliners just like A 320s or B 747-400s, they were part of my life.
It as simple as that.

Jean Pierre.


Dooltd 09-30-2015 04:21 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I agree with Captain Jean-Pierre, although I draw the dividing line with the introduction of wide bodied aircraft.
To me the classics are prop planes and the B-707, 727, DC-8, DC-9 and Caravelle.
Modern airliners start with B-747, DC-10, and L-1011.
Purely subjective of course. :cool:

Zendocon 09-30-2015 04:30 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I think this is getting off topic. We can start another topic about the definition of classic vs modern airliners. For this one, let's just go with whatever classic means to YOU.

vertigo 09-30-2015 04:58 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I can't stand contemporary airline schemes. Everytime I see Gemini's/JC's obsession in modern aircrafts in their announcements, it just makes me sad. They have no soul, no spirit. It is just mass transportation. It doesn't generate enthusiasm on my side. Last time I flew with easyjet, I didn't felt anything at all. It was just plain stupid tranportation from point A to B.

I have almost quit this hobby as these kids who are horny at 30 new B777/A330 releases every month, seem to be the only valid target customer group for manufacturers nowadays.

KLM4me 09-30-2015 05:15 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I just wish we'd see releases of a few former airlines that are not represented at all from 1:200 manufacturers, like Air Florida and PEOPLexpress, to name two.

SouthwestAirlines103 09-30-2015 05:21 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vertigo (Post 1516690)
I can't stand contemporary airline schemes. Everytime I see Gemini's/JC's obsession in modern aircrafts in their announcements, it just makes me sad. They have no soul, no spirit. It is just mass transportation. It doesn't generate enthusiasm on my side. Last time I flew with easyjet, I didn't felt anything at all. It was just plain stupid tranportation from point A to B.

Prime example why general aviation is the largest part of my love of aviation.



Quote:

Originally Posted by vertigo (Post 1516690)
I have almost quit this hobby as these kids who are horny at 30 new B777/A330 releases every month, seem to be the only valid target customer group for manufacturers nowadays.

Haha. That's pretty funny and very true. I really hoping to see expansion of the Gemini General Aviation line soon.

Zendocon 09-30-2015 05:43 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Nobody's willing to take chances, except for maybe Hobby Master. Let's see Air North and Canadian North! Heck, even Air Transat or Sunwing would be a step in the right direction (yes I realize Sunwing is modern only). Why not some AirCal or RenoAir? How about Golden Nugget? Why can't we have some early Alaska liveries? Bring on Wardair and Pacific Western!

Charlie Alpha 09-30-2015 05:55 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zendocon (Post 1516650)
I think this is getting off topic. We can start another topic about the definition of classic vs modern airliners. For this one, let's just go with whatever classic means to YOU.

Sorry, but not defining what you are trying to measure just seems silly to me. How can you get any meaningful number if one person considers a 747 a classic and another limits 'classics' to propeller driven aircraft. If you talked about propeller driven aircraft, first, second and current generation of jet aircraft, at least the opinions would mean something.

For me, a classic is everything that came before the 747. For others, it might include 727s and 737s, or just propeller driven aircraft. But I bet others have their own ideas too.

Like many (most?) I collect mostly current aircraft, but have a few first generation jets and propeller driven aircraft and turboprops that have memories or mean something to me. I think my collection is typical, but maybe not. If it is typical we SHOULD see mostly current aircraft, but include limited numbers of classics too. But then again, this forum isn't the world. I bet current aircraft comprise the bulk of the model airplane market.

Zendocon 09-30-2015 06:16 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Your opinion is noted, Charlie_Alpha. ;)

It really doesn't matter. Do you prefer newer planes or older ones? I'm not going to argue the criteria.

simon65 09-30-2015 06:16 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
My collection is mainly newer Airliners, 747-400s 777s, 787s, A380, A350 A330s, though i have a few A300s, a 727 a TU-144 and recently bought three 747-100s.

OnlyWayToFly 09-30-2015 07:44 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zendocon (Post 1515850)
So far, I like what I'm hearing. There is a very vocal group in here who are adamant that nobody wants classics anymore and that companies need to focus on the modern planes, but I think there's a lot of demand for classic airliners here and there should be a more even split.

The "very vocal group" claiming that "nobody wants classics" is as full of it as the fabled Christmas goose. There's a huge, unmet demand for classics that is nowhere near being met.

Look at the B-737-300, to choose one example among many. Even though a lot of -300s are still flying, there is only one 1/200 737-300 model in the colors of a U.S. airline (GJ's United). This in spite of the fact that almost all U.S. airlines have operated the -300 at one time or another over the last 30 years, some of them in more than one livery (United, Continental, Delta, Western, Air Cal, Southwest, America West and USAir to name several of the better known). Many variations of the B-707/720, 727-100/200 and 737-200/400/500 have also never been released.

We need another 777 in the colors of an Asian or Middle East airline like we need another hole in our collective heads.

Bring on the classics!!!

arctic9048 09-30-2015 09:30 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
35 Attachment(s)
If I had to take a guess, I'd say I'm about 30-40% classics. There is only so far classic I'm willing to go, though. I have no interest in a CV880 or most 707s. Generally, the classics I'm going to collect are the ones that I remember from my childhood which would be the late 80's and 90's. I'll be all over anything TWA twin stripes or Delta widget during that time frame especially.

Charlie Alpha 09-30-2015 09:53 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zendocon (Post 1516850)
Your opinion is noted, Charlie_Alpha. ;)

It really doesn't matter. Do you prefer newer planes or older ones? I'm not going to argue the criteria.

Then you have just rendered this thread pretty much meaningless to any manufacturer trying to use this to as an aid to determine what they should produce.

But since you ask, I prefer newer ones overwhelmingly. I probably only buy 3-5 'classic' (ie 707, DC-8, CV 340, 440, 880,990, Electra, Connies) per year. I probably buy 25 or more 'modern' (current use) airlines per year. I think this is typical of most hobbyists.

I think this is also why a larger variety and type of 'classic' airline is not produced.

Zendocon 09-30-2015 11:02 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I'm glad you have such a strong opinion, but I'm pretty sure the manufacturers are able to read between the lines. I want to hear about which eras people collect and that's why I prefer to leave this open. Feel free to start your own thread or to opt out of contributing to this one if it really offends you.

Charlie Alpha 09-30-2015 11:13 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
This thread doesn't 'offend' me in the least. I just think it is pretty pointless to anyone who could actually manufacture the models without some definitions. I actually asked one of the most popular manufacturers if they were influenced by 'I want posts' or polls. The response was more so by 'I want posts' if the airline involved wanted to cooperate. But the biggest driver of what models will be produced is requests from the airlines themselves, which probably explains why so few classic airlines are being produce. If they are convinced, however, that enough people want a particular aircraft type, they DO pay attention to that.

I think maybe you should request restricted answers to your posts if you really don't want to hear what people want to say. I think you may have an agenda of your own to promote in some your posts and level this kind of criticism at people who don't support that agenda or agree with you.

Again, I think the market has decided and is producing the amount of 'classic' airliners that the market will support at this time. I'm happy with the amount of 'classics' that are being produced, but would love to see a better 707-320B mold and a few Russian aircraft including the IL-76. So how would you classify the IL-76?

SouthwestAirlines103 10-01-2015 02:01 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by arctic9048 (Post 1517130)
Generally, the classics I'm going to collect are the ones that I remember from my childhood which would be the late 80's and 90's. I'll be all over anything TWA twin stripes or Delta widget during that time frame especially.

Yes 80s-90s! Funny how that's now fitting the classic category. Anything Widget, USAir or even pre merger USAirways, Northwest bowling shoe, etc

The it'd be nice to see 737's 757's and 767's without winglets as well.

DELTA-711 10-01-2015 02:57 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Im a modern collector dont really have any classic... although I guess the Concorde could be called a classic now and I do have a BA Hogan version...

My collection is the airlines I have listed in my signature... so am happy with alot of releases lately... but I understand frustrations with lack of classics produced... maybe if there was more classics then my collecting habits may change in future...

European Collector 10-01-2015 07:43 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
usually i buy what i like, in the last months most models i purchased would fit into the retro category. but to me retro doesn't primarily have to mean the aircraft has to be from the 60s or 70s....it is more a feeling of missing the cheatline lieveries of decades long ago in general.... also resulting of own flight or spotting experiences, and of course own asthetic preferences concerning aircraft and liveries.

what is annoying me, is that we have a good 727 mould made by GJ/JC, but they don't they use it - WHEN GJ uses ist they only do for US airlines, why don't they give us more european liveries - (or non US airlines in general) on that airframe.... the list is endless - and why JC seems to be out of the race? we definetely need one more manufacturer to focus on DC-9s, 732s and 727s (no, not IF200)! those moulds are totally neglected.

and most welcome as new completely new moulds are Il-62, Il-86 ....and Tu-154/B

KLM4me 10-01-2015 11:26 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by European Collector (Post 1517522)
what is annoying me, is that we have a good 727 mould made by GJ/JC, but they don't they use it - WHEN GJ uses ist they only do for US airlines, why don't they give us more european liveries - (or non US airlines in general) on that airframe.... the list is endless - and why JC seems to be out of the race? we definetely need one more manufacturer to focus on DC-9s, 732s and 727s (no, not IF200)! those moulds are totally neglected.

I agree with you completely on this. Which airlines would you like to see on a 727? I would like to see the Iraqi curved cheatline livery done again.

r3500vdp 10-01-2015 11:40 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I think some manufacturers have recognized the demand for more classic aircraft, companies like Aeroclassics 200 scale, SMA and to a limited extend Inflight200. For me, the majority of my classic models is made by Herpa due to my ciriteria being Eastern Europe aircraft types. I think one of the all time classic aircraft, the Sud Caravelle is very deafening in its absence, other than the short lived Hogan/Herpa effort from years ago.

European Collector 10-01-2015 11:54 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
basically most european IF200 releases. PLUS:















yes, thats a pretty long list, but i think it will take some time until these are available on a good mould,
so i've got some time to find some space where to pu them. :D

arctic9048 10-01-2015 11:56 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
35 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthwestAirlines103 (Post 1517330)
Yes 80s-90s! Funny how that's now fitting the classic category. Anything Widget, USAir or even pre merger USAirways, Northwest bowling shoe, etc

The it'd be nice to see 737's 757's and 767's without winglets as well.

Yes. They seem obsessed with winglets. AA's 767's flew without winglets and in bare metal for 20 years but a bare metal winglet is the model you have.

European Collector 10-01-2015 11:56 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by r3500vdp (Post 1517866)
I think some manufacturers have recognized the demand for more classic aircraft, companies like Aeroclassics 200 scale, SMA and to a limited extend Inflight200. For me, the majority of my classic models is made by Herpa due to my ciriteria being Eastern Europe aircraft types. I think one of the all time classic aircraft, the Sud Caravelle is very deafening in its absence, other than the short lived Hogan/Herpa effort from years ago.

plus one!


KLM4me 10-01-2015 11:59 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
My faves are the Alia and the Saudia. I'm surprised the Saudia has not yet been done.

Upkeep 10-01-2015 12:10 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Personally, I have a fondness for both categories -- Classic & Modern -- as I can appreciate the visual merits of both. I can see beauty of industrial design in a 777, as I can in a Concorde, as I can Jean-Pierre's Arc en Ciel, as I can my precious Bristol Britannias. :cool:

Primarily, I like to collect models of aircraft that have impacted me in one way or another, or are hopefully going too. As far as 'classics' are concerned, I think we're reasonably well-served by the various manus today (albeit some REALLY need to do their research) such as Herpa, Western, HM, and others.

The modern? Well, we know where that all comes from and in my humble opinion the models are getting better, not worse, so this is a good time to exercise ones choices. ;)

Vive la différence! :D

Upkeep 10-01-2015 12:14 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 (Post 1516474)
Sorry, I forgot the picture.

Jean Pierre.

Wow!! That is really a classic. Details? Scale? I wouldn't mind adding that to my collection too. :cool:;)

Sgt Caribou 10-01-2015 02:24 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
This is really subjective but a good topic. It does seem closely related to age; how would someone say 18 years old consider a B767? Probably as a prehistoric plane. Someone at the half-century mark (yours truly) considers the 767 as still a modern airliner, because the memory of it being newly introduced doesn't seem like that long ago, and also because they are still in general use. Perhaps the schemes worn on them would better define them as classic (e.g., Canadia>n Airlines vs First Air). Please count me in for the "classics" which to me include anything not currently remaining in service, or in rare/limited numbers (B727, B742, L10, DC-10, A300 and anything before those). The endless parade of wingletted twins got old long ago! Also still waiting patiently for the Dash-7.

727pilot 10-01-2015 03:25 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
I'm definetely going with the classics-crowd! As a forum-member mentioned above: There is too much focus on Asian / Arab Peninsula carriers in combination with B744 / B777 releases. Very well said!

I would love to see new moulds for the 727-200, the A310 and more releases of 747-classics. A Caravelle would also be nice!

DC-Jets 10-01-2015 03:46 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
This is a fun thread to read and I'm glad you started the discussion.

I'm definitely a collector of the classic and probably in a minority category of classic airframes because I focus solely on Douglas / McDonnell Douglas aircraft. DC-8, DC-9, DC-10, MD-11, MD-80, and MD-90.

culture 10-01-2015 08:03 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
You can add me to the "classics" camp as well. We seem to have a decent representation of most of the modern airframes, with even the variants (-200, -300, LR, etc.) while there are many classic airliners that are missing.

I suspect the reason we see so many Asian and Arab versions is that they are commissioned (and therefore paid for) by those airlines. By contrast a classic airliner would require that the tooling pay for itself with sales -- with an aging population that's a riskier proposition.

Roydair 10-01-2015 10:21 PM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Classics, classics and classics! For the more pedantic among us, I define Classic as anything designed before 1970 and any livery up to about 1990. Totally bored by the contemporary, corporate- lowest common denominator designs.

BobRinder 10-02-2015 01:54 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
My collection is classic: 1945 thru first gen jets. My current holy grail would be the Martin Twins. Close behind the Boeing 307 and a Lockheed Lodestar.

AIR FRANCE 340 10-02-2015 02:25 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BobRinder (Post 1519050)
My collection is classic: 1945 thru first gen jets. My current holy grail would be the Martin Twins. Close behind the Boeing 307 and a Lockheed Lodestar.

Quite interesting, people collecting models in this category are rare, could you please publish some photos ?

Thanks.

Jean Pierre.

BobRinder 10-02-2015 04:05 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Hello Jean Pierre,

Sorry to report no photos right now. When time permits I will correct that and post them. Today is my Birthday, 71yrs., and I spent my childhood absolutely obsessed with the color, sound and smell of the 1950's Midway Airport in Chicago. Guess my generation is fading and that incredible era in airliners is no longer in vogue. Sad.

Regards..
Bob

727pilot 10-02-2015 09:12 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Happy birthday, Bob!!! :)

Thijs 10-02-2015 09:37 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
My collection's theme is "the history of commercial flight", and ranges from as early as I can get hold of until today. The pre-WWII planes are hard to get hold of, there are some Hobby Master, Sky Classics, Small World and Helmet. A number of iconic airplanes are not made in 1:200 yet, such as Ford Trimotor, Junker 52 and Fokker VII and XII, even though they could be made with a number of liveries from both sides of the Atlantic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobRinder (Post 1519050)
My collection is classic: 1945 thru first gen jets. My current holy grail would be the Martin Twins. Close behind the Boeing 307 and a Lockheed Lodestar.

not the Lodestar but comes very close: http://www.diecastaircraftforum.com/...lockheeds.html

AIR FRANCE 340 10-02-2015 10:11 AM

Re: Modern Airliners vs Classics
 
Before it's too late, Happy Birthday to you Bob !

Jean Pierre.


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