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Old 10-21-2012, 10:09 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Convair Coronado ....

I'm sure that many of you have seen on ACB or Aviation Megastore this beautiful Swissair Coronado.
Sadly it is in the 1/400 scale.

Just check the engines, the same as the B 58 Hustler (except after burner), the anti shocks bodies on the upper wings ...
Wonderful.

Just a negative comment.
I'm not sure that this plane had emergency escape ways on the wings when it was in service.

I wouldn't mind having this iconic aircraft in my favourite scale.

Maybe one day ?

Jean Pierre.

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Old 10-21-2012, 10:11 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

That would be a nice arrival
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Old 10-21-2012, 10:21 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post

Just a negative comment.
I'm not sure that this plane had emergency escape ways on the wings when it was in service.
Jean Pierre.
I'm not sure they did either. I worked Spantax Coronado flights back in the 80s, but I honestly can't be sure that they did'nt, but I would have thought it unlikely.

I have seen a picture of an Air France Coronado, in an all over polished metal scheme. Anyone know the story behind that?
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Old 10-21-2012, 10:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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I'm not sure they did either. I worked Spantax Coronado flights back in the 80s, but I honestly can't be sure that they did'nt, but I would have thought it unlikely.

I have seen a picture of an Air France Coronado, in an all over polished metal scheme. Anyone know the story behind that?
If I remember well, these planes were leased from Modern Air, a US airline based in Germany.
I know very little about this.

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Old 10-21-2012, 11:12 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

A picture of this model ...

Jean Pierre.

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Old 10-21-2012, 12:29 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

I've never seen a photo of a Swissair Convair 990 with white wings and anti-shock bodies.

Lots of photos here
Fleet - Convair CV990

HB-ICC on display at the Swiss Transportation Museum in Lucerne has everything painted dove gray but I think that's for preservation purposes.

And you're right Jean Pierre, there should be no emergency escape routes on the wings.

They just sort of make it up as they go along don't they...

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Old 10-21-2012, 02:00 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Noticed this topic and thought............... FINALLY!
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Old 10-21-2012, 04:23 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by KRASAIRIL62 View Post
Noticed this topic and thought............... FINALLY!
Me too! You do get some envy making releases in the 'not sure I can see it scale.'
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Old 10-21-2012, 05:33 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

You're quite correct, they never had grey wings or emergency escape markings on the wings when in service. This model is supposed to portray HB-ICC as it is now preserved at the Lucerne Transport Museum. The wings and belly have been painted a metallic light grey to preserve them, but the colour and markings on the model are completely wrong.

You can clearly see this aircraft in the Lucerne Museum that has the wing pods painted grey and parts of the wings but no emergency exit walkways even in preservation! Poor research and QC by Witty400!


Thankfully Aeroclassics have released the very same model, HB-ICC, this month with the correct metal/silver wings and belly as it was in service.
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The missing B.707s still needed to be done in 1/400: Uganda Airlines, Air Zimbabwe (rainbow scheme), Air Niugini.

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Aeroclassics Comets still missing- Dan Air (4 & 4C), United Arab Airlines/Misrair/Egyptair, Kuwait AW, Sudan AW, East African AW, Saudi Royal Flt.

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Old 10-21-2012, 10:35 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Looks like walkways are there, albeit smaller than on the model above.
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Old 10-22-2012, 01:20 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by KRASAIRIL62 View Post
Noticed this topic and thought............... FINALLY!
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirFreddie View Post
Me too! You do get some envy making releases in the 'not sure I can see it scale.'
+2
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Old 10-22-2012, 05:57 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Maurice, I like your UTA A340, yes it would have looked very nice. I think that livery would also look good on the 777-300.
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Old 10-22-2012, 06:08 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
If I remember well, these planes were leased from Modern Air, a US airline based in Germany.
I know very little about this.

Jean Pierre.
Convair Coronado ....-p1070825.jpg

....my pleasure to illustrate Jean Pierre information ; its a Shaarschmidt 1/100 model, one pod missing unfortunately.
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Old 10-22-2012, 11:19 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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Maurice, I like your UTA A340, yes it would have looked very nice. I think that livery would also look good on the 777-300.
Green doors on a white plain with a blue tail??? That's 70's genius! I'm pretty sure it would still be used if UTA still existed
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:46 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

The pic of the Swissair CV-990 brings back memories.Had visited the Lucerne Museum somewhere in the mid 90s and it was a wonderful experience.
This airplane is crying out to be produced in diecast 1/200.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:12 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

I got to visit Verkehrshaus der Schweiz and the beautiful HB-ICC in 1996 and yes it was an airplane geek thrill What I remember most was thinking "what a waste of power" with four big jets out on the wings and a narrow DC-9-like cabin... poor Convair, bad bad move (a mistake which I believe Boeing almost made as well)
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Old 10-23-2012, 02:08 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prop-Jet Electra View Post
I got to visit Verkehrshaus der Schweiz and the beautiful HB-ICC in 1996 and yes it was an airplane geek thrill What I remember most was thinking "what a waste of power" with four big jets out on the wings and a narrow DC-9-like cabin... poor Convair, bad bad move (a mistake which I believe Boeing almost made as well)
It's true, I understand that right after the Being engineers returned from Hatfield where they visited the Comet line, they increased the fuselage cross section on their future B 707.

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Old 10-23-2012, 05:11 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

When the Coronados were 6 miles out on approach you didn't need a scope to ID it. The black trail said it all. And upon departure what a climb out ! Happy days at LAP.
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Old 10-23-2012, 07:12 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

No comment.

Jean Pierre.

Last edited by AIR FRANCE 340; 09-12-2013 at 07:30 AM.
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Old 10-23-2012, 09:29 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

That is an 880, not a Coronado. Guess they left a trail too.

Flew a Convair jet once - TWA 880 DEN-ORD at night in early '70s.

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Old 10-23-2012, 01:15 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

You are absolutely right, 990 had an engine which was an evolution of the one which powered the 880.
Both engines CJ 805-3 and 805-23 were very smoky.

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Old 10-24-2012, 12:30 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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It's true, I understand that right after the Being engineers returned from Hatfield where they visited the Comet line, they increased the fuselage cross section on their future B 707.

Jean Pierre.
The original Boeing 367-80 and 377 Stratocruiser had the same fuselage width of 132 inches allowing only four-abreast seating. Boeing increased the width to 144 inches accomodating five-abreast configurations and allowing shared tooling with the KC-135 Stratotanker. However once Boeing heard the airlines were pleased with the extra room in the 147-inch-wide Douglas DC-8 they were obliged to respond by increasing the 707 width to 148 inches - I guess one extra inch for good measure.

Poor Convair just dropped the ball altogether.

The actual numbers were not in my head, had to get it all off the 'net
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Old 10-24-2012, 02:48 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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The original Boeing 367-80 and 377 Stratocruiser had the same fuselage width of 132 inches allowing only four-abreast seating. Boeing increased the width to 144 inches accomodating five-abreast configurations and allowing shared tooling with the KC-135 Stratotanker. However once Boeing heard the airlines were pleased with the extra room in the 147-inch-wide Douglas DC-8 they were obliged to respond by increasing the 707 width to 148 inches - I guess one extra inch for good measure.

Poor Convair just dropped the ball altogether.

The actual numbers were not in my head, had to get it all off the 'net

Thank you, every plane has a story behind it, which is always interesting to know.

Jean Pierre
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Old 10-24-2012, 03:51 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
No comment.

Jean Pierre.
indeed, that's how jet engine supposed to look like
also hear the noise came from this garuda coronado, love that
http://www.openbeelden.nl/media/1758...ig_op_Schiphol
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Old 10-24-2012, 12:13 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

How about this one?

Convair Coronado ....-mam-990-swissair.jpg

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Old 10-24-2012, 01:24 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

I have no real knowledge of the Coronado, but it looks good.

I sincerely would like to see the release of this model in our scale.

I only remember that our Caravelles were unable to rival Spantax Coronados when approaching Madrid or Balearic airports.

Could we have more information on the model please ?

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Old 10-24-2012, 02:47 PM   #27 (permalink)
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How about this one?

Attachment 79703

- Danny
So I'm gussing that's a CAM 200 scale job ? Historic/Metal Models/Heathrow Models type model ?

Whatever, it doesn't look bad, especially when there's nothing else. I may have a 1:190 plastic kit somewhere.
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Old 10-24-2012, 03:36 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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How about this one?

Attachment 79703

- Danny
Wow what a beautiful model! Was that in the collection you had displayed at the university in Houston a few years ago? It was the most comprehensive collection I'd ever seen and I took pictures (the old fashioned non-digital kind). I've got the photos around here somewhere.

On your 990 the only small and to me unimportant mistake are the black "Swissair" titles and cockpit anti-glare paint. These details should be dark blue. That is the universal mistake with Swissair liveries on model airplanes, I think because in so many photos the blue appears to be black. From an asthetic standpoint I actually prefer the black details - artistic license you know


Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
Thank you, every plane has a story behind it, which is always interesting to know.

Jean Pierre
And as I think you know Jean Pierre I live for those stories and mundane details! I only recently learned (I think here on DA.C) that the Comet and Caravelle noses are the same? Is that true? It's all good
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:23 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

And as I think you know Jean Pierre I live for those stories and mundane details! I only recently learned (I think here on DA.C) that the Comet and Caravelle noses are the same? Is that true? It's all good [/QUOTE]


It is true.

SNCASE, later called Sud Aviation bought the license.

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Old 10-25-2012, 11:00 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Graham- That is a 'Jetwings' 990 (later called 'MAM'- Metal Airliner Model?) that I got from CAM in 1998 ($135 including postage). In 2000 I got the AA from Andrew Klein, when he had CAM USA.

PropJet- Yes, that was my collection on display at Rice University in December 2003 (100 yrs of aviation, etc), but it was the AA 990 there. Did I meet you then? Here is one of my record shots....I would love to have these glass cases. Ten years on, collection is much bigger now.

Convair Coronado ....-ds-collection.jpg

Jean Pierre- Note French classics. A few weeks ago, I saw a great 1:200 collection at LeBourget with incredible unique models, including French early R&D jets. I have shots.

- Danny

Last edited by samu990; 10-25-2012 at 11:02 AM.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:55 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by samu990 View Post
Graham- That is a 'Jetwings' 990 (later called 'MAM'- Metal Airliner Model?) that I got from CAM in 1998 ($135 including postage). In 2000 I got the AA from Andrew Klein, when he had CAM USA.

PropJet- Yes, that was my collection on display at Rice University in December 2003 (100 yrs of aviation, etc), but it was the AA 990 there. Did I meet you then? Here is one of my record shots....I would love to have these glass cases. Ten years on, collection is much bigger now.

Attachment 79705

Jean Pierre- Note French classics. A few weeks ago, I saw a great 1:200 collection at LeBourget with incredible unique models, including French early R&D jets. I have shots.

- Danny
No Danny we didn't meet. As I recall you had mentioned here on the forum that the collection was on display at Rice University. I happened to be in Houston and stopped by to see it. Wow I can't believe it's been 10 years - yikes! Your collection was (is) incredible - you have models of some really obscure stuff. I remember the huge French six-engined seaplane - Latécoère 631 - who else has a model of that?! Really really cool.

I'd love to have those glass cases too. Similar cases can be purchased at new and used retail fixture stores but they're notoriously expensive.
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Old 10-25-2012, 02:47 PM   #32 (permalink)
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No Danny we didn't meet. As I recall you had mentioned here on the forum that the collection was on display at Rice University. I happened to be in Houston and stopped by to see it. Wow I can't believe it's been 10 years - yikes! Your collection was (is) incredible - you have models of some really obscure stuff. I remember the huge French six-engined seaplane - Latécoère 631 - who else has a model of that?! Really really cool.

I'd love to have those glass cases too. Similar cases can be purchased at new and used retail fixture stores but they're notoriously expensive.

I have an unbuilt vacform Latécoère 631 in 1/72 scale, I managed to get all the information I could on this obscure flying boat.

The only thing I have to do, is to start work on it.

The less I can say, is that it could be a very challenging task.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-25-2012, 10:17 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

I have that same vacform! Still in its box I'm afraid.



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I have an unbuilt vacform Latécoère 631 in 1/72 scale, I managed to get all the information I could on this obscure flying boat.

The only thing I have to do, is to start work on it.

The less I can say, is that it could be a very challenging task.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:53 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Vacform and I don't get along at all. Years ago my one and only vacform attempt was a 1:144 Boeing Stratocruiser. It ended in disaster. Must have locator pins!

This is probably the same kit - spectacular!
http://www.seawings.co.uk/Late631SimonLindArticle.htm


If you'd like to see it fly


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Old 10-26-2012, 03:55 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Yes, this is the kit I have, the model is fantastically made, I have some hard work ahead ...
I have one of the documents listed by the author and I think I could ask the help of the AF Museum.

Thank you for the link, the story of the two prototypes is correct.
First time I see a video showing this plane, very good !

I also have a vacform Bréguet Deux Ponts, same scale ...

Sorry, we were talking about the Coronado ...

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Old 10-26-2012, 06:37 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Sooo anybody already figured out if we will have the Coronado on display soon or should we be satisfied with talking about one?
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Old 10-26-2012, 08:23 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

It's funny sometimes to watch these threads morph into this and that but it's all good.

I'm almost afraid for someone to actually attempt the 990. Case-in-point: I've wanted a decent 1:200 F-27/FH-227 for years and look at the Hobby Master Horror that is supposed to be filling that niche. If an upcoming 990 (or 880) turns out as bad as that poor Friendship then it's game over. The 990 wing is complicated and will require extra attention by someone who knows what they're doing. Not only do the four engine nacelles have to be the right shape, the right size, and hang properly off the leading edges from pylons that are again the right shape and the right size -- but now we have anti-shock bodies requiring the same vigilance. Shock bodies must be the right shape, the right size, and be positioned properly along the trailing edges of both wings. If anything is off a centemeter it will trigger a red flag in my head and that will be the only thing I am able to see every time I look at it.

We have the technology (somewhere... ) and it can be done.
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Old 10-27-2012, 03:16 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

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It's funny sometimes to watch these threads morph into this and that but it's all good.

I'm almost afraid for someone to actually attempt the 990. Case-in-point: I've wanted a decent 1:200 F-27/FH-227 for years and look at the Hobby Master Horror that is supposed to be filling that niche. If an upcoming 990 (or 880) turns out as bad as that poor Friendship then it's game over. The 990 wing is complicated and will require extra attention by someone who knows what they're doing. Not only do the four engine nacelles have to be the right shape, the right size, and hang properly off the leading edges from pylons that are again the right shape and the right size -- but now we have anti-shock bodies requiring the same vigilance. Shock bodies must be the right shape, the right size, and be positioned properly along the trailing edges of both wings. If anything is off a centemeter it will trigger a red flag in my head and that will be the only thing I am able to see every time I look at it.

We have the technology (somewhere... ) and it can be done.
I agree the project is fraught with danger. A manufacturer may well decide that an 880 is merely a 990 without pods. My understanding is that this not true at all. So if anyone is going to attempt the Convair jetliner project I hope someone on here is in touch with them !

The Chinese are brilliant at copying, but not so good at original creation from drawings. My guess is that they would copy an old kit by profiling from it. What they would really need is an old accurate large scale display model (in need of restoration) and some notes from someone who knows about 880/990's.
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Old 10-27-2012, 03:49 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Let us pray that one day we will have a good model of this plane.
As said, ideally, an active participation of someone having a good knowledge of the plane is essential.
Manufacturers able to accept this are rare.
Most often they prefer to keep everything secret and when the job is done, it is too late.
And even when it is not too late, it is too late because they don't want to change anything.

Jean Pierre.
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Old 10-27-2012, 04:16 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Default Re: Convair Coronado ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIR FRANCE 340 View Post
Let us pray that one day we will have a good model of this plane.
As said, ideally, an active participation of someone having a good knowledge of the plane is essential.
Manufacturers able to accept this are rare.
Most often they prefer to keep everything secret and when the job is done, it is too late.
And even when it is not too late, it is too late because they don't want to change anything.

Jean Pierre.
You know the old joke about how many therapists does it need to change a light bulb.
(Only one but the bulb must be willing to change.)
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Last edited by Graham Bridges; 10-27-2012 at 04:20 AM.
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