Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20 - DA.C
 

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Old 12-23-2013, 07:24 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20



It seems to have made its first flight today. What a joke. It took the 30 years to reverse engineer it.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:33 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Or maybe less than 2 years after they got a peek at the modified Blackhawks used in ObL raid.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:35 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.



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Old 12-23-2013, 11:12 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

I don't think its a exact copy where the parts are interchangeable, only looks visually similar.
The Chinese also make a close copy of the AR-15/M16 rifle - for export markets.
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Old 12-23-2013, 11:14 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20



Here it is visiting a gas station.
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Old 12-24-2013, 12:06 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azaros View Post
I don't think its a exact copy where the parts are interchangeable, only looks visually similar.
The Chinese also make a close copy of the AR-15/M16 rifle - for export markets.
You hit the nail on the head right there. It is a copy of the Blackhawk (which they purchased solely to copy and took 30 years to do so) that is meant for the Chinese.
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Old 12-24-2013, 12:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Why waste time on copying a old helicopter concept like the Blackhawk? the NH-90 is a far more practicable helicopter. And for the NH-90 they might have gotten a manufacturing license too.

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Old 12-27-2013, 04:28 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

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Originally Posted by Azaros View Post
... And for the NH-90 they might have gotten a manufacturing license too. ...
I am very confident that they would not have been able to obtain a manufacturing licence. The NH90 is currently made by Eurocopter (France), Eurocopter-Deutschland (Germany), Agusta (Italy), Stork-Fokker (Netherlands) and Patria (Spain). NHI is essentially the Project Manager (based in France) with each company is responsible for specific parts of the helicopter with robust protections in place to prevent intellectual property inadvertently transferring from one company to another. Final assembly is undertaken by Eurocopter. Whilst the MRH90 (the Australian NH90) is assembled in Australia by Australian Aerospace (AA), AA is wholly owned by Eurocopter.
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Old 12-29-2013, 02:05 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

The Blackhawk is a 30+ year old design, a modern Huey. It's a utility helicopter that's fairly common in many nations, so it's kind of "meh" that they copied it. Besides, they had some S-70C-2 helos bought directly from the US anyway.
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Old 01-04-2014, 07:38 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

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Originally Posted by Delta Airlines View Post
It seems to have made its first flight today. What a joke. It took the 30 years to reverse engineer it.
Yeah I'd like to see how long it would take for you to reverse engineer a chopper

And thats better then the US who just wait for ppl to defect with the plans lol they don't even bother trying or they just buy the aircraft from former operators

Also goes to show how easy it is for them to find out about such technology, I don't see the US copying the Flanker and Fulcrum, some of the best aircraft in the world, oh but they have the F-35 looooooool enough said
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Old 01-04-2014, 08:33 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Thumbs down Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azaros View Post
Why waste time on copying a old helicopter concept like the Blackhawk? the NH-90 is a far more practicable helicopter. And for the NH-90 they might have gotten a manufacturing license too.

They don't have a (liberal) President Clinton to give up secrets to the Chinese


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Originally Posted by Ukrainian_Falcons View Post
Yeah I'd like to see how long it would take for you to reverse engineer a chopper

And thats better then the US who just wait for ppl to defect with the plans lol they don't even bother trying or they just buy the aircraft from former operators

Also goes to show how easy it is for them to find out about such technology, I don't see the US copying the Flanker and Fulcrum, some of the best aircraft in the world, oh but they have the F-35 looooooool enough said
Here is your sign "retard", falling back on leftist political talking points Plz try to educate yourself instead of relying on political talking points.
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Old 01-04-2014, 09:39 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Silly politics aside (and yeah, it is silly to be outraged when someone comes out with a similar looking machine, especially as everyone seems to be getting advanced degrees from the same places these days), everyone has copied everyone to an extent when it comes to innovative technology, it isn't too surprising.

Either way, the pictures are very fuzzy at best, and it is very hard to make out details to really compare other than general shape.

Quote:
Or maybe less than 2 years after they got a peek at the modified Blackhawks used in ObL raid.
From my understanding, those were very much destroyed apart from some parts here and there, and very few people know how those choppers looked looked like apart from the few who helped set up the raid, and they're not talking yet. You'd have better luck putting finely shredded documents back together. Of course, it doesn't mean that the parts that did survive were not looked at for their materials. Anything to make a helicopter lighter, more stronger, more absorbent to certain detection methods, more agile is valuable here.

While the PRC had largely used old tooling (ARJ-21) or unfinished attempts at licnese copying (J-7, Y8), or even licnese copying (Y-7 series) in the last half century, given a decade or two, I can seriously see some highly viable domestic designs with little outside influence coming up.

Actually, now that I think about, had a professor for dynamics who claims to have worked on something like the Blackhawk a couple years back before he came to work at my school. Got deported about two or three years later. Makes ya sorta think, but then again, likely nothing really.

As for the NH-90, I don't know, they do produce(d) the Mi-171C, which can do the same things as the 90 from what I can see. If they were to develop a transport helicopter like that, I could see it based more off that. Sorta like how the MA-60 is based off the Y-7 which is based off the An-24. It seems their intention is to make a helicopter like the S-70 or H-60, with similar capabilities, and that will usually suggest a common looking design.

We'll have to see what more comes out of this.

Quote:

Also goes to show how easy it is for them to find out about such technology, I don't see the US copying the Flanker and Fulcrum, some of the best aircraft in the world, oh but they have the F-35 looooooool enough said
Why would the US need to copy the Flanker or Fulcrum? Both sides here have very competent engineers (even though our resident propaganda machines will say opposite from both sides). I feel the F-15 and F-18 are very good machines and respectably in similar classes, and assuming both sides have craft and pilots updated to current tech levels, would make for some interesting stories.

On the F-35, to loosely quote what an F/A-18E test pilot told us during a flight mechanics lesson last semester. It appears to be a good machine, but horrifically over budget.
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Old 01-12-2014, 03:10 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

It's not just US made equipment the Chinese have been accused of copying, much of the current inventory of the PLA has Russian origins. In fact I don't think the PRC could have been maintained if it wasn't for Russian technological help. In recent years when as things have gotten more $$$ driven the Russian's have more grounds to complain about Chinese copies.
Interesting article
Why Would Russia Sell China Su-35 Fighter Jets? | The Diplomat

Quote about the Chinese j-15 unauthorised copy of the SU-33 by Zhang Xinguo, deputy president of AVIC.
"“Mobile phones all look similar. But technology is developing very quickly. Even if it looks the same, everything inside cannot be the same.”

Russia downplays Chinese J-15 fighter capabilities | Defense | RIA Novosti

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Old 01-15-2014, 07:59 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

What about the "SU27" they build too.. Shenyang J-11 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 01-15-2014, 08:25 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Chinese Reverse Engineered Blackhawk: The Z-20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azaros View Post
It's not just US made equipment the Chinese have been accused of copying, much of the current inventory of the PLA has Russian origins. In fact I don't think the PRC could have been maintained if it wasn't for Russian technological help. In recent years when as things have gotten more $$$ driven the Russian's have more grounds to complain about Chinese copies.
Interesting article
Why Would Russia Sell China Su-35 Fighter Jets? | The Diplomat

Quote about the Chinese j-15 unauthorised copy of the SU-33 by Zhang Xinguo, deputy president of AVIC.
"“Mobile phones all look similar. But technology is developing very quickly. Even if it looks the same, everything inside cannot be the same.”

Russia downplays Chinese J-15 fighter capabilities | Defense | RIA Novosti
Well, as I said, a lot of what they get from Russia is licnese built. There are some projects that have taken their own form because of the Soviet-Sino Split. Two good and highly well known examples are the J-7 and Y-8, which are similar to the MiG-21 and An-12 respectively, where in the beginning, they had a lot of cooperation with the Soviets in developing domestic variants, but due to the political climate that these were developed, lead to the PRC having to find other ways to finish their own domestic developments, and thus lead to aircraft that look similar, have their own drastic differences and a life of their own.

I do remember there being some concern from the Russians about the J-11 being sold to other countries, as the Russians strictly intended for these to be built and used only by the PLAAF and PLAN.

Speaking of the J-15, I do remember some anger out there about the Varyag being converted to an operational carrier by the PLAN (it was originally sold to a company that was supposed to turn it into a floating Casino/Hotel in Macau, sorta like what was done to a Kiev Class carrier (it was the Kiev itself actually!)

Quote:
What about the "SU27" they build too.. Shenyang J-11 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It IS a licnese built Su-27.
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