No doubt about what you are saying.
Sorry, not to make myself clear.
I am just having a curiousity when the wing collisions happen, is it considered subtantial damage? Was the aircraft put on ground?
I know, Garuda B 744 has similar incident in HKG, but then it was decided that the airplane still can fly back to CGK, but the wing characteristic of two aircrafts are different, in my opinion.
__________________
You want to make a background check of a seller? Contact me, maybe I can give a name of the con-artist..... To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
The Devil’s Sea (or Dragon’s Triangle, take your pick of which sounds more ominous) is an area of the Pacific Ocean as riddled with strange happenings as its Atlantic counterpart near Bermuda. Located off the coast of Japan, it’s been the site of countless claims of unexplained phenomena including magnetic anomalies, inexplicable lights and objects, and of course, mysterious disappearances. The area is even considered a danger by Japanese fishing authorities.
One story has it that in 1952 the Japanese government sent out a research vessel, the Kaio Maru No. 5, to investigate the mysteries of the Devil’s Sea. Naturally, of course, the Kaio Maru No. 5 and its crew of 31 people were never seen again. Another story tells of Kublai Khan’s disastrous attempts to invade Japan by crossing the Devil’s Sea, losing at least 40 000 men in the process.
The usual theories abound for what’s really going on: from aliens, to gates to parallel universes, even to Atlantis (because why not). Some suggest that high volcanic activity in the region is responsible for some of the disappearances (the Kaio Maru No. 5 may have been caught in an eruption).
A group known as the Chinese Martyrs’ Brigade has reportedly claimed it is behind the disappearance of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.
Late last night, an email was sent to a number of journalists in China, threatening: “You kill one of our clan, we will kill 100 of you as payback.”
It makes a purported threat in the wake of a knife attack in Kinming last week, in which 29 people were killed and over 100 injured.
Doesn't sound too credible to me. Why only lay claim after 72 hours of the flight's disappearance?
I just read through a lot of the speculation over at A-Net (and there should be no complaints hear about speculation, because there is plenty on A-Net). The one point I may tend to agree with, is the entire plane sunk underwater without breaking up. With the lack of any debris being found so far, this does make some sense. Why and how this could happen is more speculation.
I just read through a lot of the speculation over at A-Net (and there should be no complaints hear about speculation, because there is plenty on A-Net). The one point I may tend to agree with, is the entire plane sunk underwater without breaking up. With the lack of any debris being found so far, this does make some sense. Why and how this could happen is more speculation.
Oh dear god, not the A.net forums... I can't stand to wade through so much horse ****. I can't believe people actually pay to be a member there. So many idiots and wannabes. I have a select few sites I go to where the real, honest, knowledgeable, and competent aviators and industry insiders hang out, and drivel is not tolerated... but I'll keep those sites to myself.
And just to make it clear, I have no problem with speculation when it is clearly labeled as such, and when it is based on known facts. But when people (here and elsewhere) make absurd claims to know things "for certain", especially when those things are laughably unlikely, it really rubs me the wrong way. Whatever has happened to this Malaysia flight, it's an absolute tragedy. When someone jumps the gun and shouts, I figured it out!!!, without having the first clue as to what actually occurred, I see nothing more than a pathetic attention whore trying to exploit a tragedy to gain the smallest smidgen of self-assurance. And that, frankly, is disgusting.
Oh dear god, not the A.net forums... I can't stand to wade through so much horse ****. I can't believe people actually pay to be a member there. So many idiots and wannabes.
Thats a big plus one from me.
I was a member there (CHRISBA777ER) for 12 years until i finally got bored of the mods deleting half my posts, of idiots like 1337Delta764 and his ilk, and of 12 year old FSX geeks who have never been outside of the US trying to tell me what I know for fact is untrue just because it does with with their Boeing patriot agenda.
The AvB stuff on there is just ludicrous. Awful site. Paul does a good job there but the rest of it is a money-making machine feeding off xenophobic idiots who wish they knew something about planes. They offered me my membership back for free to come back and I told them where to go.
I was a member there (CHRISBA777ER) for 12 years until i finally got bored of the mods deleting half my posts, of idiots like 1337Delta764 and his ilk, and of 12 year old FSX geeks who have never been outside of the US trying to tell me what I know for fact is untrue just because it does with with their Boeing patriot agenda.
The AvB stuff on there is just ludicrous. Awful site. Paul does a good job there but the rest of it is a money-making machine feeding off xenophobic idiots who wish they knew something about planes. They offered me my membership back for free to come back and I told them where to go.
I hope they go belly up, i really do.
I think I recognize your username. I have an account there that I made about 10-11 years ago when I was in middle or high school. Didn't post much... quit browsing years ago when the forums really started to go downhill.
A.net is awesome for pics, though. But I say that as a non-photographer. I recall wading into the photog section of the forum from time to time... tons of bickering and politics. People complaining about bad photos that were accepted but shouldn't have been... good photos that weren't, etc...
The landing in North Korea reason just blew me away!!! Imagine if that was the case!
I am assuming that some wreckage will be found in the next 24-48 hours. That way the wheels can be set in motion to determine the cause, the families can process the loss and we can see some reasons why this has occurred.
Even without the last foot of wing, the plane would still be fairly stable and fly perfectly well. Anyone remember the B-52 that flew on with about 25% of the tail remaining? These planes are built of sturdy stuff. I think it's unlikely the wing suffered a structural problem
__________________
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Even without the last foot of wing, the lane would still be fairly stable and fly perfectly well. Anyone remember the B-52 that flew on with about 25% of the tail remaining? These planes are built of sturdy stuff. I think it's unlikely the wing suffered a structural problem
Agree 100%.
Even if it was only the inexperienced FO in the cockpit and he compensated with too much reverse aileron and rudder once the AP disengaged it is hard to imagine he wouldnt immediately be referring to his AH to ensure wings level. Spatial disoríentation a factor but it takes a long time to drop from FL34 and you'd hope he was well trained enough in this scenario to compensate with an eye on the instruments. As you say it should be very controllable, and all he needs to do is configure the AP to fly wings level by pressing a button then master arm.
My argument is going off the facts that have been presented thus far, which happens to be the same information that you or any other poster on this forum has to go by.
Cockpit doors may prevent someone from entering the cockpit, but does not mean that the pilots did not come out of the cockpit for some reason.
?
Another ridiculous statement! BOTH pilots would never leave the cockpit together. One would hand over to the other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMD11
You also argue that the only thing that could prevent a Mayday call would be a catastrosphic explosion (all explosions tend to be catastrophic to some degree or another).
Another stupid quote - ALL explosions are not catastrophic - are fireworks catastrophic, is a paper bag blown up and popped catastrophic?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMD11
I do have a question for you - where is the debris? Can you give me an example of an aircraft that exploded in-flight and did not leave a trail of debris? TWA 800? Pan Am 103? Air India 182?
That is the $64,000 question, but at least we should stick to what is known and not make wild guesses that are irrelvant.
__________________
Adrian
DC-8s still needed to be done in 1/400: Air Ceylon, Air Spain, Seaboard World (-63CF)
Comets still missing- Dan Air (4 & 4C), United Arab Airlines/Misrair/Egyptair, Kuwait AW, Sudan AW, East African AW, Saudi Royal Flt.
Caravelles still not made: Luxair, Air Algerie,SABENA (final scheme), Libyan Arab Airlines, SAS ( SCANDINAVIAN titles scheme)
Ilyushin IL-18s still not made: Tarom (billboard,) Malev (1st scheme),Cubana, Balkan/ Tabso-Bulgarian Air Transport,
Glad to know from the expert here that the wing structure is as strong as it is required.
Just came to my mind...Chalk Ocean Airways Flight 101.....tragic
__________________
You want to make a background check of a seller? Contact me, maybe I can give a name of the con-artist..... To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Another stupid quote - ALL explosions are not catastrophic - are fireworks catastrophic, is a paper bag blown up and popped catastrophic?
.
Are fireworks catastrophic? On a 777 at cruise, you bet.
And although it wouldnt be catastrophic obviously just as a bit of levity, If someone blew up a paper bag in the seat behind yours while you were asleep on the flight, how catastrophic might that that seem at the time?
Are fireworks catastrophic? On a 777 at cruise, you bet.
And although it wouldnt be catastrophic obviously just as a bit of levity, If someone blew up a paper bag in the seat behind yours while you were asleep on the flight, how catastrophic might that that seem at the time?
Yeah, okay, but neither would bring a plane down?
__________________
Adrian
DC-8s still needed to be done in 1/400: Air Ceylon, Air Spain, Seaboard World (-63CF)
Comets still missing- Dan Air (4 & 4C), United Arab Airlines/Misrair/Egyptair, Kuwait AW, Sudan AW, East African AW, Saudi Royal Flt.
Caravelles still not made: Luxair, Air Algerie,SABENA (final scheme), Libyan Arab Airlines, SAS ( SCANDINAVIAN titles scheme)
Ilyushin IL-18s still not made: Tarom (billboard,) Malev (1st scheme),Cubana, Balkan/ Tabso-Bulgarian Air Transport,
Fireworks going off in the cabin? I'd suggest there was a decent chance of a serious fire. One rocket maybe not, but a few together. Decent chance of setting a fire. They burn very very hot and most "fire retardent" materials in the cabin burn just fine at those temperatures.
A serious fire at cruise in any passenger jet if uncontrolled will bring an aircraft down very effectively, either by smoke/toxic fumes overcoming pax and crew, or by fire spreading to roof area and severing electronics buses, wire trains and hydraulics lines. Remember there are typically duty free bottles of booze and non-retardent combustibles in the overheads, not to mention the oxygen generators.
I went on an aviation safety course a few years back and they told me that a cabin or toilet fire has to be tackled within 90 seconds of fiorst smelling smoke otherwise the odds are not in favour of it being a survivable event.
__________________ Stay on the bomb run, boys! I'm gonna get them doors open if it harelips ever'body on Bear Creek!(Major T.J "King Kong" from the movie Dr. Strangelove)
__________________
COLLECTING; 1/200 Boeing 737's, and one or two other classic birds
LOOKING FOR; B737's, looking for SWA Desert, WestJet, AAL (all liveries including AstroJet)
LATEST ARRIVALS: InFlight 1/200 TWA 747-100, InFlight200 Eastern L-1011 Bicentennial
ON APPROACH: nothing new
FOR SALE: GJ200 DAL L-1011 Bi-Centennial, GJ200 UAL A319 V2500, USAirways A321 V2500, GJ200 UAx Q400
SUCCESSFULLY BOUGHT FROM; BON AIRE, IranAir4Ever
SUCCESSFULLY SOLD TO: tommychui,
PLEASE EXPLAIN THIS!!!??? How is it EVEN remotely possible that some family members were ABLE to call the smartphones of their MISSING family members? IF these phones were submerged or otherwise "destroyed" by a catastrophic event like explosion or fire, HOW ON EARTH (literally) could their (smart)phones STILL ring and WORK ... and in SOME cases ... even be connected to QQ ... a Chinese social networking platform??? HUH???
Here's the story ---
The 'unprecedented mystery' behind the disappearance of Malaysian Airlines flight MH 370 deepened on Monday when relatives claimed they were able to call the cellphones of their missing loved ones.
According to the Washington Post, family of some of the 239 people on board the vanished Boeing 777 said that they were getting ring tones and could see them active online through a Chinese social networking service called QQ.
One man said that the QQ account of his brother-in-law showed him as online, but frustratingly for those waiting desperately for any news, messages sent have gone unanswered and the calls have not been picked up.
PLEASE EXPLAIN THIS!!!??? How is it EVEN remotely possible that some family members were ABLE to call the smartphones of their MISSING family members? IF these phones were submerged or otherwise "destroyed" by a catastrophic event like explosion or fire, HOW ON EARTH (literally) could their (smart)phones STILL ring and WORK ... and in SOME cases ... even be connected to QQ ... a Chinese social networking platform??? HUH???
Here's the story ---
The 'unprecedented mystery' behind the disappearance of Malaysian Airlines flight MH 370 deepened on Monday when relatives claimed they were able to call the cellphones of their missing loved ones.
According to the Washington Post, family of some of the 239 people on board the vanished Boeing 777 said that they were getting ring tones and could see them active online through a Chinese social networking service called QQ.
One man said that the QQ account of his brother-in-law showed him as online, but frustratingly for those waiting desperately for any news, messages sent have gone unanswered and the calls have not been picked up.
Dig deeper... cell networks don't always function properly and will, on occasion, indicate a cell phone is available even when it's turned off or non-functional. Bottom line, this strange situation with cell phones has been pretty well explained as being nothing more than a fluke. Disappointing as it may be, it's highly unlikely the aircraft is intact somewhere after being hijacked. It's sounding more and more like it headed west and perhaps ended up crashing in the Malaysian mountains or the Straights of Malacca.
If passenger phones were still able to ring, there must be a chance it didnt dissapear over water, surely a submerged phone would die and go straight to voicemail as if turned off. I know mine did that when my wife put mine in the washing machine.
I think a phone would sink deeper and deeper until it reached the bottom, so how could a phone ring a day or two after the dissapearance?
Another ridiculous statement! BOTH pilots would never leave the cockpit together. One would hand over to the other.
Show me where I said that BOTH pilots would leave the cockpit at the same time. I never said nor implied that both pilots would leave the cockpit at once. You're not thinking - try using some of that logic you love preaching about.
Another stupid quote - ALL explosions are not catastrophic - are fireworks catastrophic, is a paper bag blown up and popped catastrophic?
Stupid? How so? I said explosions, to one degree or another are catastrophic.
That is the $64,000 question, but at least we should stick to what is known and not make wild guesses that are irrelvant.
Which you failed to answer. Use some common sense and ask yourself if an airplane exploded while inflight why there wouldn't be any debris anywhere - no clothing, luggage, panels, bodies, fuel or oil, anything.
I am beginning to think that you are one of these 12 year olds that Mike777 was speaking about earlier who like to hang around Airliners.net and pretend to know what they are talking about.
Why don't you turn-off your computer and go finish your homework.
If the cell phone theories are to be believed, then there is some hope here in actually finding what they're looking for. If there are some phones still working (doubtful, as modern smartphones from my personal observation need to be recharged once every 4 or 5 hours it seems), then they're likely within range of some cell towers. If they are, then maybe they can triangulate the likely location of most of the debris, and thus bringing some closure to families...
__________________
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
well that clearly shows it hitting the water at 471km/h suddenly dropping from 35.000 feet to zero! it did a right left right move before hitting, then appeared to shoot forward a bit before radar contact lost. there are 2 planes to the right. two minutes in approx., the furthest aircraft also suddenly disappears to the right. it also turns circular in shape,??? then back to normal before it suddenly disappears or shoots off at high speed! if the plane has gone down in the original suspected place, there are going to be some seriously red faces!!
__________________
I BUY WHAT I LIKE. AND LIKE WHAT I BUY!!!
Now I'm reading reports from the Malaysian military that the flight did in fact travel quite far after executing a turn to the west. Military radar tracked it and claims it was flying at a "low altitude". Something very bad was going on in that aircraft. No communications, no nothing, yet it was flying off course and low. This gets more bizarre by the hour. If they can find the wreckage, perhaps answers will start unfolding.
The rescue teams havent been looking in the last known location for 3 days, I got news that the plane went off radar and continued flying for another 90 minutes, Why didnt anybody notice, or is there a cover up, I found the search expanding to the Andman sea strange considering its way over in the opposite direction of the destination but something isnt right, Could a government have shot it down? Why was the transponder switched off, From flightradar the plane dissapears but if it continued to fly for 90 minutes, governments must know where it went as ATC doesnt run on flightradar24.
If the malaysian military tracked it, Was a jet sent to follow it or guide it home ?
A friend also finds it suspicious that the family were huddled into a hotel and kept there with no news, I sense a cover up.
__________________
WANTED
Aeroclassics Garuda Indonesia F28
Last edited by Garuda747400; 03-11-2014 at 03:54 PM.
The rescue teams havent been looking in the last known location for 3 days, I got news that the plane went off radar and continued flying for another 90 minutes, Why didnt anybody notice, or is there a cover up, I found the search expanding to the Andman sea strange considering its way over in the opposite direction of the destination but something isnt right, Could a government have shot it down? Why was the transponder switched off, From flightradar the plane dissapears but if it continued to fly for 90 minutes, governments must know where it went as ATC doesnt run on flightradar24.
If the malaysian military tracked it, Was a jet sent to follow it or guide it home ?
That's exactly why this is getting really weird... Someone on the ground HAD to know something was amiss even if the crew was not communicating. Also, at some point you would think some of the passengers (sensing something was going terribly wrong) would have tried to turn on their cell phones and attempt to text or communicate as they went over the Malaysian peninsula as the plane tracked off course. That is of course assuming everyone was still conscious in the cabin...
On a 6 hour flight no doubt Malaysian had inflight entertainment switched on and with that comes the ability to track your route via the map channel, If something made the plane fly off course for 90 minutes and passengers were concious, Surely one passenger in 220 could see there location off track. If the transponder is switched off, would the tv map still be able to keep track ?
This may be a bit off topic but its something I've been meaning to ask for a long time but never got around to it. We have black boxes and FDR's to determine incidents on board a/c. How come aircraft cabins and flight decks are not fitted with CCTV cameras? In the situation of a crash, CCTV footage would be invaluable. With a FDR you only hear what the crew say, with CCTV you can see their actions too. CCTV cams placed at the rear of the flight deck above the entry door would gave a whole panoramic view of the flight deck and enable investigators to not just hear but see what happened.
This may be a bit off topic but its something I've been meaning to ask for a long time but never got around to it. We have black boxes and FDR's to determine incidents on board a/c. How come aircraft cabins and flight decks are not fitted with CCTV cameras? In the situation of a crash, CCTV footage would be invaluable. With a FDR you only hear what the crew say, with CCTV you can see their actions too. CCTV cams placed at the rear of the flight deck above the entry door would gave a whole panoramic view of the flight deck and enable investigators to not just hear but see what happened.
It certainly seems logical and invaluable, especially given the digital capture abilities (vs magnetic tape) available today. The question is could a live feed be enabled on flights so any problems could be detected by ground personnel and appropriate actions taken (as in the MH370 situation)? Maybe someone can chime in about the feasibility of this approach. I'm sure the costs would be an issue, but if integrated into the aircraft during construction it could be done easily with less money. Today's surveillance systems are light weight and small.
Something tells me this could be a forever mystery
Apparently there is being a lot of info held back from the media my mum said but who knows?
Could it have been sucked underground by gravity force?
Bermuda Triangle comes to mind?
But nothing like this has happened in this area before!
__________________
Callum
19
1:200 scale diecast model collector
U.K. based
British airlines and aircraft I’ve flown on collector
It certainly seems logical and invaluable, especially given the digital capture abilities (vs magnetic tape) available today. The question is could a live feed be enabled on flights so any problems could be detected by ground personnel and appropriate actions taken (as in the MH370 situation)? Maybe someone can chime in about the feasibility of this approach. I'm sure the costs would be an issue, but if integrated into the aircraft during construction it could be done easily with less money. Today's surveillance systems are light weight and small.
They have CCTV cameras everywhere now. On buses, trains, possibly ships so why should planes be an exception? Even the minute we step out of our houses and go anywhere we're on CCTV, on the road, inside buildings etc. CCTV has been invaluable in capturing the source of all kinds of incidents and on a plane, they would visually answer alot of questions. As they say the camera doesn't lie.
It now also says that the transponder on the aircraft was switched off then the aircraft turned back and went across Malaysia to the west side at about 30,000FT according to military radar and then it disappeared from their radar too!
Strange
__________________
Callum
19
1:200 scale diecast model collector
U.K. based
British airlines and aircraft I’ve flown on collector
That is the $64,000 question, but at least we should stick to what is known and not make wild guesses that are irrelvant.
Which you failed to answer. Use some common sense and ask yourself if an airplane exploded while inflight why there wouldn't be any debris anywhere - no clothing, luggage, panels, bodies, fuel or oil, anything.
If I could answer it, they would find the plane!!! Another stupid statement! Now consider this - perhaps it turned back over land and crashed or was blown up there and they haven't found it yet as they are concentrating on the sea?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMD11
I am beginning to think that you are one of these 12 year olds that Mike777 was speaking about earlier who like to hang around Airliners.net and pretend to know what they are talking about.
Why don't you turn-off your computer and go finish your homework.
Now I was thinking exactly the same about you as you started making the ridiculous and wild speculations and Mike777 had to put you down.
__________________
Adrian
DC-8s still needed to be done in 1/400: Air Ceylon, Air Spain, Seaboard World (-63CF)
Comets still missing- Dan Air (4 & 4C), United Arab Airlines/Misrair/Egyptair, Kuwait AW, Sudan AW, East African AW, Saudi Royal Flt.
Caravelles still not made: Luxair, Air Algerie,SABENA (final scheme), Libyan Arab Airlines, SAS ( SCANDINAVIAN titles scheme)
Ilyushin IL-18s still not made: Tarom (billboard,) Malev (1st scheme),Cubana, Balkan/ Tabso-Bulgarian Air Transport,
Suddenly the officials say the plane had gone to Strait of Malacca? Ok, big lie. The fact should be human from one of the country shot down the plane and 1 or 2 countries tried to hide the facts. End of story.
Until somebody actually finds the plane, there is no 'end of story'.
The Malaysians had been saying for a while the plane may have 'turned back'; now they're finally giving slightly more detail to that.
the chatter on anet on Sunday was reporting that there was some searching going on in the Strait, for whatever that's worth.
If it weren't for the transponder turning off, I would suspect hypoxia - this wouldn't be the first time a plane just kept flying itself, in such a scenario.
But then why did the transponder turn off? Was it intentional? Is there an event progression that can make that happen as part of the accident?
Suddenly the officials say the plane had gone to Strait of Malacca? Ok, big lie. The fact should be human from one of the country shot down the plane and 1 or 2 countries tried to hide the facts. End of story.
There is absolutely no evidence the plane was shot down. If it were, there would have been debris scattered all over the area where the aircraft was at the time it veered off course. And now that it's being confirmed the aircraft flew for quite awhile prior to disappearing off the military's radar, the "shot down" theory is even more implausible. This is most definitely NOT the "end of story".
Until somebody actually finds the plane, there is no 'end of story'.
The Malaysians had been saying for a while the plane may have 'turned back'; now they're finally giving slightly more detail to that.
the chatter on anet on Sunday was reporting that there was some searching going on in the Strait, for whatever that's worth.
If it weren't for the transponder turning off, I would suspect hypoxia - this wouldn't be the first time a plane just kept flying itself, in such a scenario.
But then why did the transponder turn off? Was it intentional? Is there an event progression that can make that happen as part of the accident?
Somebody needs to find that plane.
i cannot understand why something as important as the transponder can simply be turned off with the flick of a switch!
Re: Malaysia Airlines 777 Missing
I have an account there that I made about 10-11 years ago when I was in middle or high school. Didn't post much... quit browsing years ago when the forums really started to go downhill.
Your Privacy Choices
