Travelin' Man

That is Airbus of course.

As the launch of Ted is just around the corner, it appears that the seating arrangement will be the first 40% of the Aircraft dedicated to economy plus seating, while the remaining 60% will be regular economy steerage.

So unless you are a UAL Premier member with eliete status, or are willing to foek over more money (which defeats the concept of a discount carrier) then old Ted is going toss you in the back of the 'bus.

So where is the incentive to go with Ted over Fronter? Let's see, Frontier has lower fares, lower fuel charges and taxes, a better FF program, more destinations, TV's on every seat, and you are not going to get stuck in the back on every flight.

Ted on the other hand has higher fares, the fuel charges are more, no individual TV, but you can watch Ted TV and (Ted Tunes -n which is different from regular TV how?), you are limited to a small route network, and you are flying on repainted UAL planes.

The advantages that Ted can offer are the ability to accrue miles in the UAL FF program (which are pretty much worthless these days as UAL is making it harder to redeem them for anything), the chance to fly in a slightly roomier economy seat, and you get the chance to buy food if you are hungry.

So will Ted work? We shall see. If this is the best UAL's crack management can come up with as a response to the discount carriers, then we are talking big disapointment here folks. There is really nothing new and innovative about Ted. If the fares were sometihing like $99 one way every day, then that would get some attention. But like the Shuttle by UAL, the fares are nothing new or low to say the least. If it wern't for Frontier, Ted would have never offered matching fares. What a sad state UAL the once great UAL has become.

Father Manicotti

I can’t believe the Judge in charge of their bankruptcy allowed UA to engage in such mind-blowing stupidity. The thing that perplexes me about United creating “Ted” is that when they started their West Coast “Shuttle by United” they killed off their mutant offspring only when it got a little too successful for its own good. A lot of UA insiders that I have spoken to over the years have time-and-again said the “shuttle” was a going concern. The main problem with all of this is the fact that the “parent” of this diseased little tad pole needs to get their own sh*t together. If their house was in order a stunt like “Ted” wouldn’t even be on the table. It’s funny to think that an upstart like Frontier is going to not only continue eating United’s lunch at Denver, but will completely obliterate poor little “Ted”. I feel for all the long-time employees of United. Scott is someone I consider a good friend and wish him nothing but the best. Why in God’s name would you have a pseudo 2-class cabin, and why would their fares consistently be on par with their mainline operation. Quite frankly, I don’t see much of a future for carriers like “Ted” or even JetBlue for that matter. If you want a good laugh, T-Man, check out “Ted’s” website and then check out Independence Air’s website. Just to compare “Ted’s” website looks like something thrown together by Hasbro … it’s some funny-a$$ sh*t.

P.S. I sure as hell hope they will paint over that God-awful “Ted” scheme quicker then it has taken them to paint over old “Shuttle” birds when all this nonsense comes to an end.

__________________
"I'm not saying He wasn't crucified, I'm just saying it wasn't for you." - Hazle Motes

Travelin' Man

The Independence Air web site is awesome. Independence Air is also a business model worth watching because if it works, and it should, look for other regional carriers to go off on their own and compete against Big Brother.

Interesting note: A few months ago when in Denver there was still a 737 with the Shuttle by United livery. And to think UAL is going to change their livery once again. This will take how many years? And I am not buying into the D check justification. A new coat of paint won't hide a house that needs major repair.

By the way, I hope the best for the UAL employees. They deserve better and perhaps one day will get the management and board that puts them first after the customer of course.

Father Manicotti

I would love to see a return to true regional airlines instead of all this franchise, co-op bullsh*t!!!

__________________
"I'm not saying He wasn't crucified, I'm just saying it wasn't for you." - Hazle Motes

Scott

T-Man, you are such a childish and whiny boor. Have you nothing better to accomplish than spout falsehoods, half-truths, and uninformed opinion?

Ted, like most airlines, will offer a tiered fare structure. There are only about 6 to choose from - some will land you in economy plus, others will sit in standard Airbus coach seats - wider than most others. People sit in the back of Southwest, Jet Blue, Air Tran, and ATA: your "back of the bus" analogy has borderline racist overtones.

The first fact you ignore is that Ted will have a lower CASM (cost per available seat mile) than Frontier. Are you aware Frontier's stock took a hit when Ted re-aligned fares? An independent survey by a Denver newspaper found that Ted was competitive in all markets? State your case that Frontier's frequent-flyer plan is better than UA's.

Ted was designed to operate in leisure markets where F/C seats were largely "upgraded". Consequently, the revenue mix with 156 seats is vastly improved. The aircraft will have greater utilization with faster "turn" times. Unlike the Shuttle, Ted will geographically mesh with the entire operation - arguably the best route structure in the industry.

Want more proof? Many UA employees were initially miffed by the concept. Most of my peers are quite confident Ted will be a success - increasingly so as we are briefed and become more knowledgeable. UA employees are among the most jaded and critical; we do not gratuitiously shill for any management team.

There.... that was more bandwidth than I planned to waste on your continuously subversive, reckless, and incorrect analyses.
And stop with your smarmy statements of "gee, I really wish the best for UA". At least have the integrity to bash an airline AND build a credible case!

__________________
Fly the Friendly Skies of United

uniTED takes wing Feb 12, 2004

Starliner

Not having flown United for several years, I was most pleased with a recent IAD-DFW flight, considering how Mother Nature was doing her best to keep the planes on the ground. When a mechanical threatened to cancel our A319, UA located a "spare" A320 and had us on our way with only a hour delay. Other carriers were cancelling their flights. We had a fairly light load, and considering the logistics nightmare, no one's bags were lost and limited catering was made available. Plus the Captain gave thorough explainations and reassurances of deicing and takeoff procedures. Despite the limited catering, the FAs still made 2 rolls of the beverage cart and everyone seemed to get what they wanted. The plane itself was very clean and comfortable (Economy). And a couple hours of "Channel 8" ATC listening made for a very enjoyable ride. Although UA is not a big player in my area (OKC-DFW), I look forward to flying them again.

Travelin' Man

The decline in Frontier stock has nothing to do whatsoever with Ted. It has to do with how institutional investors buy and sell stock based on earning reports. Nevertheless, there is nothing wrong with Frontier and they are posting record profits.

Frontier has a better FF program because one can actually redeem the miles that one accrues. I still have over 175,000 UAL miles and have been unable to redeem them for any flights. That wasn't always the case, but it is getting harder and harder. My travel habits havn't changed, and I am not noticing that the flights are any fuller, so I have to scratch my head and ask what has made redemption so gosh dang hard of late?

Back of the Bus - Nothing racist intended, but if you are not a UAL FF elite member, that is where you are going to sit. UAL's attitude is still treat the loyal customers like gold and everyone else like second class citizens. Not that there is anything wrong with treating loyal customers like gold, but everyone should be treated the same, and UAL all too often fails in this department. Of course it all depends on the cabin and gate crews, but I notice attitudes change quickly when I whip out my 100k card. Go to a Ritz Carlton hotel and everyone gets their but kissed.

When we looked at Ted and the service, we noticed that the fare's were all over the place. I had hoped Ted would keep it simple, but like UAL they just have to squeeze every nickle out of a customer as they can. Of the 20 trips that we looked at, Ted was dead last in price behind Frontier, America West, and Delta. Yes Delta. The big catch was the fuel charges were higher then the competitors.

I have always given my employees the choice of carriers that they can fly. What is interesting is that my top 5 road warriors have made the shift last year from flying UAL to Frontier. I had nothing to do with their decisions, but they all told me that Frontier is consistently a offering better service at significantly lower prices. I have noticed that we have been spending singificantly less on airline flights in the last 12 months; but more on hotels and dining on business travel. Hey these guys know where to get the most out of their budgets.

I guess my big question is if Ted is such a great idea and success, then why isn't the entire domestic mainline UAL fleet moving over to that business model?