Will jetBlue become the NEW united?

06-07-2002, 08:07 PM

So..how Big do you think jetblue will get? Will they ever get larger airplanes for intl flights? What do you think?
thanks
jamie

continental sat · 06-07-2002, 08:53 PM

I dont think they will get any other aircraft I basically think they will be just like southwest but with A320s maybe not as succesful although they are doin good now they might not be a couple months or years down the road

airman62 · 06-08-2002, 07:20 PM

They have some sweet short term deals on aircraft financing and other costs, that will begin to expire in the next couple years. I think Jet Blue is on to something, however I wouldn't buy the stock until they are playing on the same level as WN, F9, etc. - that will be the real test.

jjorgemiami · 06-11-2002, 03:04 PM

Geminiman, NO ONE will ever be another UNITED ! United is here, and is here to stay, it is unique and no one can ever equal it. Similar maybe but never another UNITED. The mold has been broken!

Scott · 06-11-2002, 04:03 PM

See the previous post for some of the reasons Jet Blue will never be the next "United"! I'll give most of the upstarts credit for low fares, a fresh look and artificially low initial operating costs. IMHO this is not the sole criterion by which we judge longevity. UA, AA, DL, NW,TW, PA, and a few others have contributed to the impeccable safety of the industry by plowing profits into operational (read safety) advances. And no, this was not solely accomplished during the wild and wooly days of props and government regulation. UA recently led the path toward Ehnanced Ground Proximity Warning systems, (in the wake of AA at Cali, Columbia) Predictive Wind Shear as an enhancement to traditional wind-shear electronics, Future Air Navigation Systems, etc. I'm afraid it'll be cold day in hell before we see new upstarts contemplate ground-breaking endeavors where the "rubber meets the runway".

continental sat · 06-11-2002, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Scott
See the previous post for some of the reasons Jet Blue will never be the next "United"! I'll give most of the upstarts credit for low fares, a fresh look and artificially low initial operating costs. IMHO this is not the sole criterion by which we judge longevity. UA, AA, DL, NW,TW, PA, and a few others have contributed to the impeccable safety of the industry by plowing profits into operational (read safety) advances. And no, this was not solely accomplished during the wild and wooly days of props and government regulation. UA recently led the path toward Ehnanced Ground Proximity Warning systems, (in the wake of AA at Cali, Columbia) Predictive Wind Shear as an enhancement to traditional wind-shear electronics, Future Air Navigation Systems, etc. I'm afraid it'll be cold day in hell before we see new upstarts contemplate ground-breaking endeavors where the "rubber meets the runway".

very well put!

Scott · 06-12-2002, 12:45 AM

Thanks, Continental Sat! Believe me, UA is not the only airline to invest significant capital toward safer operations - even when not required by the FAA. It has been many years since Southwest was considered an "upstart". I know they conform to all FAA standards, run an efficient and profitable airline, have generally outstanding morale, and are loved by most customers. All very admirable!! Yet I cannot think of a safety contribution they have made to the industry. No, this is not "Southwest bashing"; if someone can correct me I'd appreciate it.

airman62 · 06-12-2002, 11:11 PM

In the end it isn't going to matter what sort of innovations United, American, Delta and the others brought to the industry. What will count is if they can figure out how to compete in the new world order, which doesn't allow for generous wage gains to the tune that United has dealt with recently for its pilots and mechanics, and is focused on a cost wary travelling public. Jet Blue and Southwest will never be United or American, but they just might be the one's that out live them based on the economic reality we are now in. The next 18 months will be very telling.

Scott · 06-13-2002, 12:04 AM

Good points, Airman62. Today's passengers really don't care how the industry achieved a fabulous safety record, they accept it as a given and focus on the lowest fare or best value. My point was that new upstarts will not likely achieve the "legacy" of the original major carriers. And those fine points are best appreciated and debated amongst airline aficionados.
The survival of UA, AA, CO, DL, US, and NW is dependant upon striking a balance of value and cost containment. In reality, most of the "old guard" operate with nearly identical employee cost factors of approx 36% - a divergence of a few points either way. No less than Don Carty of AA publicly states that the employee "burden" is not excessive. However, new upstarts enjoy artificially low labor, maintenance, and infrastructure costs.
I do agree the next 18 months shall be interesting!

06-07-2002, 08:07 PM	#1
geminiman Guest Posts: n/a	Will jetBlue become the NEW united? So..how Big do you think jetblue will get? Will they ever get larger airplanes for intl flights? What do you think? thanks jamie

06-11-2002, 03:04 PM	#4
jjorgemiami Complete Wacko! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: MIAMI Age: 47 Posts: 5,857	???????????? Geminiman, NO ONE will ever be another UNITED ! United is here, and is here to stay, it is unique and no one can ever equal it. Similar maybe but never another UNITED. The mold has been broken! __________________ Fly United Airlines we are R I S I N G !

06-11-2002, 04:03 PM	#5
Scott Insane Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Escondido, Ca. USA Age: 50 Posts: 2,763	See the previous post for some of the reasons Jet Blue will never be the next "United"! I'll give most of the upstarts credit for low fares, a fresh look and artificially low initial operating costs. IMHO this is not the sole criterion by which we judge longevity. UA, AA, DL, NW,TW, PA, and a few others have contributed to the impeccable safety of the industry by plowing profits into operational (read safety) advances. And no, this was not solely accomplished during the wild and wooly days of props and government regulation. UA recently led the path toward Ehnanced Ground Proximity Warning systems, (in the wake of AA at Cali, Columbia) Predictive Wind Shear as an enhancement to traditional wind-shear electronics, Future Air Navigation Systems, etc. I'm afraid it'll be cold day in hell before we see new upstarts contemplate ground-breaking endeavors where the "rubber meets the runway". __________________ Fly the Friendly Skies of United uniTED takes wing Feb 12, 2004

06-12-2002, 12:45 AM	#7
Scott Insane Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Escondido, Ca. USA Age: 50 Posts: 2,763	Thanks, Continental Sat! Believe me, UA is not the only airline to invest significant capital toward safer operations - even when not required by the FAA. It has been many years since Southwest was considered an "upstart". I know they conform to all FAA standards, run an efficient and profitable airline, have generally outstanding morale, and are loved by most customers. All very admirable!! Yet I cannot think of a safety contribution they have made to the industry. No, this is not "Southwest bashing"; if someone can correct me I'd appreciate it. __________________ Fly the Friendly Skies of United uniTED takes wing Feb 12, 2004

06-13-2002, 12:04 AM	#9
Scott Insane Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Escondido, Ca. USA Age: 50 Posts: 2,763	Good points, Airman62. Today's passengers really don't care how the industry achieved a fabulous safety record, they accept it as a given and focus on the lowest fare or best value. My point was that new upstarts will not likely achieve the "legacy" of the original major carriers. And those fine points are best appreciated and debated amongst airline aficionados. The survival of UA, AA, CO, DL, US, and NW is dependant upon striking a balance of value and cost containment. In reality, most of the "old guard" operate with nearly identical employee cost factors of approx 36% - a divergence of a few points either way. No less than Don Carty of AA publicly states that the employee "burden" is not excessive. However, new upstarts enjoy artificially low labor, maintenance, and infrastructure costs. I do agree the next 18 months shall be interesting! __________________ Fly the Friendly Skies of United uniTED takes wing Feb 12, 2004

06-07-2002, 08:53 PM	#2
continental sat USAF Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Everywhere Age: 23 Posts: 605	I dont think they will get any other aircraft I basically think they will be just like southwest but with A320s maybe not as succesful although they are doin good now they might not be a couple months or years down the road

06-08-2002, 07:20 PM	#3
airman62 Collector Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: California, USA Posts: 65	They have some sweet short term deals on aircraft financing and other costs, that will begin to expire in the next couple years. I think Jet Blue is on to something, however I wouldn't buy the stock until they are playing on the same level as WN, F9, etc. - that will be the real test.

06-12-2002, 11:11 PM	#8
airman62 Collector Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: California, USA Posts: 65	In the end it isn't going to matter what sort of innovations United, American, Delta and the others brought to the industry. What will count is if they can figure out how to compete in the new world order, which doesn't allow for generous wage gains to the tune that United has dealt with recently for its pilots and mechanics, and is focused on a cost wary travelling public. Jet Blue and Southwest will never be United or American, but they just might be the one's that out live them based on the economic reality we are now in. The next 18 months will be very telling.

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