Airbus Chief Accuses United States of Helping Rival Boeing After Sept. 11

Gordon Werner · 12-13-2001, 05:19 PM

Thursday December 13, 4:03 pm Eastern Time

Airbus Accuses U.S of Aiding Boeing
Airbus Chief Accuses United States of Helping Rival Boeing After Sept. 11

PARIS (AP) -- The head of European aircraft manufacturer Airbus criticized recent U.S. government aid packages issued in the aftermath of Sept. 11, saying they provided "direct help" for Airbus' U.S.-based rival, Boeing Co.

Airbus president Noel Forgeard said in an interview published in Thursday's edition of Les Echos, a financial daily, that the U.S. aid was a "veritable Boeing Marshall Plan."

In September, the U.S. Congress approved a $15 billion relief package for the U.S. airline industry. The package seeks to restore vitality to a sector of the economy devastated by the Sept. 11 attacks.

Forgeard also denounced parts of a separate $20 billion anti-terrorism package for the Pentagon, which was approved by Congress last week.

The defense measure includes language that would establish a new program in which the government would lease up to 100 Boeing 767s to be used as air tankers to replace an aging fleet.

Forgeard called it "a form of direct help" for Boeing.

The arrangement, which would cost at least $20 billion over a decade, would be a financial boon for the struggling aerospace company, which announced this fall plans to cut 30,000 of 95,000 jobs at its Seattle-based commercial airplanes division by the end of 2002.

Forgeard said Airbus planned to deliver 300 civil aircraft in 2002, compared to the 375 planes it had expected to deliver prior to the Sept. 11 attacks.

The company has agreed with United Airlines -- which lost two of its aircraft in the suicide hijackings -- to shelve about half of United's order for 44 aircraft, which was due for delivery next year, he said.

Forgeard said Airbus hoped to find new buyers for some 15 planes that collapsed carrier Swissair had ordered for delivery between 2002 and 2005.

DeltaFlot · 12-13-2001, 05:42 PM

The EU would do the same thing if the attacks had bee in Europe, so this is just whining on there part

hernan · 12-13-2001, 08:57 PM

Airbus sucks!

Marc Hookerman · 12-13-2001, 09:02 PM

There is nothing that four hours under water couldn't cure for this poodick.

Scott · 12-14-2001, 02:22 AM

Foregeard or Foreplay or whoever the hell you are.... quit whining and worry "big-time" about your vertical fins on both the A-300 and A-320. Gonna cry about Boeings devotion to aluminum now??

Steven De Lisser · 12-14-2001, 11:37 AM

I for one agree with what Mr Noel Forgeard said, that, "Boeing does make a better plane, the French are rude, often wrong and mainly subsidized."

Atleast this is what I got from the article.

Steve

george · 12-14-2001, 01:09 PM

AIRBUS SUCKS!!!
(Part 2)

Chansen · 12-14-2001, 01:18 PM

Somebody has to pay for the A380!

I think the Pres. of Airbus isn't on stable enough ground. The A300-600 crash of American didn't help them either! Wasn't that structural failure. Yeah what a whiner! What happend to the A400 program?

Wingman · 12-14-2001, 03:02 PM

This is kind of like the pot calling the kettle black, isn't it?

Would Airbus be where it is today without the assistance of the many European governments whose nations makeup the company?

How many Euros from the EU are going into the A380 project? How many Euros will be "contributed" by the EU when Airbus decides to pursue its own Sonic Cruisier in order to compete against Boeing?

It is just plain silly for Mr. Forgeard to be complaining the way he is.

12-14-2001, 03:26 PM

Yeah, keep on whining Airbus, although, if I were you, I'd shut up, because Boeing will probably end up doing better with the Sonic Cruiser than your A380.

Forrest Tohill · 12-14-2001, 03:49 PM

Hey, I'll be visiting Planet Earth soon. Does anyone know of any good commercial aircraft manufacturers in the area?

ptolbert · 12-14-2001, 05:20 PM

Ahh crap. We're saving our companies and our jobs so we can help lead the world. This guy is jellous cause he didnt get any money.
This frinche has a Baguette up his @$$.

Travis Campbell · 12-14-2001, 07:06 PM

This is crap! Airbus is funded by the governments of Europe, Boeing is a private company. Now when Boeing gets similar treatment, now it is bad? That's good thinking. This thing even furthers my belief that the French Government and Airbus have their heads to far up their rears to realize what happened on September 11th and the reprocussions it has not only here, but around the world. They are pretty much the only member of NATO and the UN that is against everything every other member does and reacts. Sorry to our French posters, but this is pure stupidity.

Travelin' Man · 12-15-2001, 12:09 PM

Like the USAF is going to purchase Airbus tankers. Forgive my friend Noel as we went out the night before this interview in Zurich and had one too many brewskies. He forgot to thank the US government in providing financial aid to several of Airbuses largest customers, US Airways, Northwest, and Frontier Airlines. My good buddy Sam Addoms at Frontier is still moving forward with his Airbus orders, so in effect, AIRBUS has also benefited from the US government aid package as well.

Look all Noel is doing is building a case for his company to receive direct government subsidies from EU members. The fact is with as many orders that they are receiving, Airbus is still not in a position to make profits. The A380 has not received enough orders at a fair market price to even make the program near a point of profitibility. So it will be only a matter of time when Airbus has to ask for help. Of course Airbus wasn't companining when the EU squashed the GE Honneywell merger. That decision gave Airbus a competitive advantage, big time.

Noel, buddy, let's not piss off the US government anymore then you need to right now. Fact is Airbus is under a lot of heat right now in the largest Airliner market in the world. First thier is the A300 tail fin incident. We wouldn't want FAA to ground any of your beloved A300's until the conclusion of a lenghty investigation? Then as far as I know, there is still a safety problem with the A340-600 passing FAA evacuation requirements. No FAA certificate means no sales for customers serving the US. And now we must also think about the A380 and how the FAA will receive it. Can it pass an the FAA minimum evacuation and safety requirements? Doubtful at best without some type of a waiver. If the A380 is not allowed in US airspace, that is a large market that the plane can't serve. So Noel, don't be pissing off the US taxpayer right now.

Starliner · 12-16-2001, 03:34 PM

A380 will likely stay nothing more than drawings in magazines and models on our shelves.

Stanman · 12-17-2001, 01:09 PM

I agree with Travellin man that Forgeard doesn't seem to credit the US with also supporting in billions of dollars of grants the US airlines that have Airbus products on order. I think this is mainly publicity to deflect attention and US criticism on the European subsidies and possibly an indirect request for the EU to grant subsidies to airlines of their own in order to support and possibly boost Airbus sales. More or less just politics. If Forgeard said that they weren't hurt much and continued to be thriving financially then there wouldn't be a need for the subsidies they are getting and they might possibly lose them. This way the subsidies keep flowing in and may actually increase if he whines/lobbies hard enough.

Tony Sepanski · 12-18-2001, 12:52 PM

Pretty much a new twist on Airbii's whiney old complaint that the US government subsidizes Boeing because they purchase military aircraft from them. He's able to some how equate this with the giving of funds to Airbus for no return other than keeping them in business.

Pardon the steam pouring out of my ears, but this line of illogic absolutely infuriates me. And he's allowed to get away with it in the international press.

T-man, that was an excellent point about Frontier being able to continue their Airbii order due to the influx of emergency funds from the federal gov't. This really goes to show how far up the sphincter region Airbii management has their corporate cranium.

Tell me which looks more like the subsidy:

Air Force leases 767 tankers over 20 year to replace the 40-year old KC-135's they're currently using.

OR

The governments of Britain, France and Germany give billions of Euro's to Airbii so they can build the A380 and sell it at discounted rates.

Hmmm.

elsarno2 · 12-19-2001, 12:54 AM

What's wrong with America helping american companies. We need to take care of our own first. Airbus needs to shut up.

12-13-2001, 05:19 PM	#1
Gordon Werner Insane Collector Join Date: Jun 1998 Location: Somewhere else Age: 37 Posts: 2,059	Airbus Chief Accuses United States of Helping Rival Boeing After Sept. 11 Thursday December 13, 4:03 pm Eastern Time Airbus Accuses U.S of Aiding Boeing Airbus Chief Accuses United States of Helping Rival Boeing After Sept. 11 PARIS (AP) -- The head of European aircraft manufacturer Airbus criticized recent U.S. government aid packages issued in the aftermath of Sept. 11, saying they provided "direct help" for Airbus' U.S.-based rival, Boeing Co. Airbus president Noel Forgeard said in an interview published in Thursday's edition of Les Echos, a financial daily, that the U.S. aid was a "veritable Boeing Marshall Plan." In September, the U.S. Congress approved a $15 billion relief package for the U.S. airline industry. The package seeks to restore vitality to a sector of the economy devastated by the Sept. 11 attacks. Forgeard also denounced parts of a separate $20 billion anti-terrorism package for the Pentagon, which was approved by Congress last week. The defense measure includes language that would establish a new program in which the government would lease up to 100 Boeing 767s to be used as air tankers to replace an aging fleet. Forgeard called it "a form of direct help" for Boeing. The arrangement, which would cost at least $20 billion over a decade, would be a financial boon for the struggling aerospace company, which announced this fall plans to cut 30,000 of 95,000 jobs at its Seattle-based commercial airplanes division by the end of 2002. Forgeard said Airbus planned to deliver 300 civil aircraft in 2002, compared to the 375 planes it had expected to deliver prior to the Sept. 11 attacks. The company has agreed with United Airlines -- which lost two of its aircraft in the suicide hijackings -- to shelve about half of United's order for 44 aircraft, which was due for delivery next year, he said. Forgeard said Airbus hoped to find new buyers for some 15 planes that collapsed carrier Swissair had ordered for delivery between 2002 and 2005.

12-13-2001, 05:42 PM	#2
DeltaFlot The Patriot Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Laurel, MD Age: 36 Posts: 3,228	The EU would do the same thing if the attacks had bee in Europe, so this is just whining on there part __________________ Febuary 15, 1898 December 7, 1941 June 8, 1967 September 11, 2001 Never Forget, Never Forgive If you kick the Tiger in the arse, you better be able to deal with the Tiger's teeth.

12-13-2001, 08:57 PM	#3
hernan Senior Collector Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: CAROLINA,PUERTO RICO Age: 42 Posts: 426	Airbus sucks! __________________ FLY SOUTHWEST. THE ONLY WAY TO FLY ! COLLECT STAR JETS. THE BEST MODELS!

12-13-2001, 09:02 PM	#4
Marc Hookerman DC-10 Lover Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Saint Louis, MO USA Posts: 352	There is nothing that four hours under water couldn't cure for this poodick. __________________ Jet Noise : The Sound of Freedom Midwest Express Airlines "The Best Care in the Air"

12-14-2001, 02:22 AM	#5
Scott Insane Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Escondido, Ca. USA Age: 50 Posts: 2,763	Foregeard or Foreplay or whoever the hell you are.... quit whining and worry "big-time" about your vertical fins on both the A-300 and A-320. Gonna cry about Boeings devotion to aluminum now?? __________________ Fly the Friendly Skies of United uniTED takes wing Feb 12, 2004

12-14-2001, 11:37 AM	#6
Steven De Lisser Master Collector Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 783	I for one agree with what Mr Noel Forgeard said, that, "Boeing does make a better plane, the French are rude, often wrong and mainly subsidized." Atleast this is what I got from the article. Steve

12-14-2001, 01:09 PM	#7
george Master Collector Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: IAD-DCA-BWI/MIA/PHX Posts: 759	AIRBUS SUCKS!!! (Part 2) __________________ KERRY/Edwards2004 /////////////////////////

12-14-2001, 01:18 PM	#8
Chansen Complete Wacko! Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 3,016	ScAirbus Conspiracy theory, true! Somebody has to pay for the A380! I think the Pres. of Airbus isn't on stable enough ground. The A300-600 crash of American didn't help them either! Wasn't that structural failure. Yeah what a whiner! What happend to the A400 program?

12-14-2001, 03:02 PM	#9
Wingman Registered User Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Bangor, ME Age: 34 Posts: 429	This is kind of like the pot calling the kettle black, isn't it? Would Airbus be where it is today without the assistance of the many European governments whose nations makeup the company? How many Euros from the EU are going into the A380 project? How many Euros will be "contributed" by the EU when Airbus decides to pursue its own Sonic Cruisier in order to compete against Boeing? It is just plain silly for Mr. Forgeard to be complaining the way he is.

12-14-2001, 03:26 PM	#10
ccdj747400 Guest Posts: n/a	Yeah, keep on whining Airbus, although, if I were you, I'd shut up, because Boeing will probably end up doing better with the Sonic Cruiser than your A380.

12-14-2001, 03:49 PM	#11
Forrest Tohill Master Collector Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Age: 51 Posts: 713	Hey, I'll be visiting Planet Earth soon. Does anyone know of any good commercial aircraft manufacturers in the area?

12-14-2001, 05:20 PM	#12
ptolbert Insane Collector Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Waco/Woodway, Tx Age: 22 Posts: 1,205	Ahh crap. We're saving our companies and our jobs so we can help lead the world. This guy is jellous cause he didnt get any money. This frinche has a Baguette up his @$$. __________________ Ptolbert Long Live N615DL!!!!! ------------------------------ One World United together fighting poverty, social injustice, and foreign Domination of Industries, and just plain dumb people.

12-14-2001, 07:06 PM	#13
Travis Campbell Insane Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Detroit, Michigan (Roughly) Age: 27 Posts: 1,067	This is crap! Airbus is funded by the governments of Europe, Boeing is a private company. Now when Boeing gets similar treatment, now it is bad? That's good thinking. This thing even furthers my belief that the French Government and Airbus have their heads to far up their rears to realize what happened on September 11th and the reprocussions it has not only here, but around the world. They are pretty much the only member of NATO and the UN that is against everything every other member does and reacts. Sorry to our French posters, but this is pure stupidity.

12-15-2001, 12:09 PM	#14
Travelin' Man Insane Collector Join Date: May 2000 Location: Aspen USA!!! Posts: 1,919	Like the USAF is going to purchase Airbus tankers. Forgive my friend Noel as we went out the night before this interview in Zurich and had one too many brewskies. He forgot to thank the US government in providing financial aid to several of Airbuses largest customers, US Airways, Northwest, and Frontier Airlines. My good buddy Sam Addoms at Frontier is still moving forward with his Airbus orders, so in effect, AIRBUS has also benefited from the US government aid package as well. Look all Noel is doing is building a case for his company to receive direct government subsidies from EU members. The fact is with as many orders that they are receiving, Airbus is still not in a position to make profits. The A380 has not received enough orders at a fair market price to even make the program near a point of profitibility. So it will be only a matter of time when Airbus has to ask for help. Of course Airbus wasn't companining when the EU squashed the GE Honneywell merger. That decision gave Airbus a competitive advantage, big time. Noel, buddy, let's not piss off the US government anymore then you need to right now. Fact is Airbus is under a lot of heat right now in the largest Airliner market in the world. First thier is the A300 tail fin incident. We wouldn't want FAA to ground any of your beloved A300's until the conclusion of a lenghty investigation? Then as far as I know, there is still a safety problem with the A340-600 passing FAA evacuation requirements. No FAA certificate means no sales for customers serving the US. And now we must also think about the A380 and how the FAA will receive it. Can it pass an the FAA minimum evacuation and safety requirements? Doubtful at best without some type of a waiver. If the A380 is not allowed in US airspace, that is a large market that the plane can't serve. So Noel, don't be pissing off the US taxpayer right now.

12-16-2001, 03:34 PM	#15
Starliner Senior Collector Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Norman OK USA Posts: 452	A380 will likely stay nothing more than drawings in magazines and models on our shelves.

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12-17-2001, 01:09 PM	#16
Stanman Senior Collector Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Waxahachie, Texas, USA Posts: 426	I agree with Travellin man that Forgeard doesn't seem to credit the US with also supporting in billions of dollars of grants the US airlines that have Airbus products on order. I think this is mainly publicity to deflect attention and US criticism on the European subsidies and possibly an indirect request for the EU to grant subsidies to airlines of their own in order to support and possibly boost Airbus sales. More or less just politics. If Forgeard said that they weren't hurt much and continued to be thriving financially then there wouldn't be a need for the subsidies they are getting and they might possibly lose them. This way the subsidies keep flowing in and may actually increase if he whines/lobbies hard enough.

12-18-2001, 12:52 PM	#17
Tony Sepanski Master Collector Join Date: May 2000 Location: Seattle, WA, USA Posts: 798	Pretty much a new twist on Airbii's whiney old complaint that the US government subsidizes Boeing because they purchase military aircraft from them. He's able to some how equate this with the giving of funds to Airbus for no return other than keeping them in business. Pardon the steam pouring out of my ears, but this line of illogic absolutely infuriates me. And he's allowed to get away with it in the international press. T-man, that was an excellent point about Frontier being able to continue their Airbii order due to the influx of emergency funds from the federal gov't. This really goes to show how far up the sphincter region Airbii management has their corporate cranium. Tell me which looks more like the subsidy: Air Force leases 767 tankers over 20 year to replace the 40-year old KC-135's they're currently using. OR The governments of Britain, France and Germany give billions of Euro's to Airbii so they can build the A380 and sell it at discounted rates. Hmmm.

12-19-2001, 12:54 AM	#18
elsarno2 Junior Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hampton, VA Age: 35 Posts: 39	What's wrong with America helping american companies. We need to take care of our own first. Airbus needs to shut up.